TromboneChat

Hi, all.
Never had been a big fan of large bore tbns ( .547) due to the weight and dimensions of this 42.BUT it was the way to go for our symphonic wind band. Anyway, if the scheduled concert program gives room for my 3B, I use to swap horns for easier service. Well, now it was time again for the 42. It is a wonderful horn, nice appearance and one of the fine Bachs.
The boss asked for a really fat higher range trombone sound , so I put in a large tenor / small bass mpc, Giardinelli 2G -- 26.5 mm. First chair. No problem for me to keep up with full range up to f. Checked that very tone at home - and boom! I felt the acustic pressure on the left eardrum like never before while not being particularly loud..... subsequently that brutal tinnitus started off right away. It lasted a week. At that time, I still doubted it being related to the trombone exclusively.

Fast forward.
I had been warned. Next rehearsal saw me playing the 6.5AL Bach, sort of standard for the 42. Alrighty. Little squeaking. Ok.

I use to practice a lot, up to 5 hrs per day, retired 2 years ago, single household, so what.

In between, I had prepared 2 small bores with 12C and checked of getting rid again of that 42 fat piggy. Alright, sound is ok -and enough for the band.
Today no tinni. Hm.There was my somehow beloved 42B on its stand, and the 6.5AL. Well, boy, just give it a short try. Why not?
The answer came quickly. Beeeeeeep.......
Same perception, eardrum felt being pressed inward. This time, it had not been a very high note, just Eb or something. Nor had it been loud. Oops.
I can trace down two reasons:
A. This fine Bach 42 offers high efficiency, easy HiOutput esp with large mpcs like Giard. 3G or 2G. I was not aware of.
B. I'm well trained and live in a very silent environment that enables developing a hyperacusis. The ear sharpens while hearing nothing, sort of. I know that behavior of my ears.
I contacted the horn dealer and will check out a 36 next week. The .500 bones are not critical in the above mentioned manner.
I put in earplugs. A lot of sound comes via mandibular bone, do not underestimate. Check it by putting in left earplug only and play. That's really some amount of sound.

Watch out.
Good luck.

I have tinnitus, but did not get it from my own playing, it's a gift from the trumpeters I have had for years in the back of my neck. At one time I also got the hyper acoustic phenomenon that made everything distorted and from that occation was also my tinnitus permanent. It was to the degree I had to quit playing for half a year and didn't end until I finally got into medical care. Tinnitus can really drive you crazy if it is so severe you can not sleep. Eventually the distorted hearing disappeared, but the tinnitus is for life. I'm lucky to be able to ignore it since it is a very high frequency, about 12000 hz, but it is turned on always. This happened 20 years ago and after it just happened I didn't play anything for five months but then scaled up my playing again when I noticed it did no further harm to my hearing. Today I'm back and play all situations just as before. I always have earplugs on stage, but mostly they are in my pocket. I use them only in the situations I know the trumpets will blow their brains out. Take care and make sure you have earplugs ready when situation is bad.

/Tom

I don't know the current status of this, but I read about it a couple of years ago.

https://www.tinnitustreatmentreport.com ... 0volume%3F

I also have moderate tinnitus and hyperacusis. Like imsevimse, it’s from the trumpet players, drums and basses when I was a teenager and 20-year-old playing jazz bands and not wearing earplugs. It gets much worse with allergies and colds—congestion plays a big part, I think. Nasal irrigation helps during allergy season and when I get a cold.

Unfortunately, tinnitus and hpyeracusis are all too common for musicians. In my experience, not enough is said about the necessity of protecting hearing. For the younger musicians here on TC, please wear hearing protection.

Once you’ve got tinnitus and hyperacusis, you can’t make them go away. You can learn to live with them. There’s an app I used to use: ReSound Relief. It uses a combination of mindfulness and exposure to help quiet the ringing. It works pretty well.

The most helpful thing I’ve found is what a teacher and mentor told me: Make friends with it.

If you can't wear earplugs DURING exposure, wear them AFTER like driving home from the gig. It does help your ears to recover.

Sometimes I wear my earplugs at home when practicing loud, especially in smaller spaces.

I not only have tinnitus, but moderate hearing loss. The tinnitus doesn’t really bother me, but the hearing loss was starting to bother my wife, frequently having to repeat things. Diagnosed with some loss 20+ years ago, but functioned fine. Cause: Playing in baritone high school band low on list. Pistol and rifle shooting as a kid, back in the day when only “professional” shooters used hearing protection…thanks dad. Loud motorcycles…my bad. Enter hearing aids. Worst investment I ever made…yes, I can hear the wife, but not much else. After a year and a half, they are slightly bearable. Music, finally getting partially correct adjustment for brass, but live only. Any recorded music is over processed. Piano, just hearing, not playing, and singing, forget it. Playing any brass instrument, forget it. Fortunately I only play at church where we use in-ear monitors and leader has a talkback mic. I’ve only ever worn one earphone while playing, I need an open ear to correctly hear my horn as I’m playing. Going to a different place next week, hopefully this person can help me more than the last. (How bad is it you ask…imagine having to take a hearing aid out to hear the cool sounding Jake brake of the truck immediately in front of as as reported by my grandson!)

Doug Elliott wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 12:08 pm If you can't wear earplugs DURING exposure, wear them AFTER like driving home from the gig. It does help your ears to recover.

Yes. It may work, made same observation, but results are inconsistent in my case.

Nest step will be an acustical correction of the naked walls of the rehearsal room.

I’ve found that I need to consider several factors in taking care of my hearing. As Doug said, wearing some protection after the gig can be helpful. Another environment I’ve found difficult is schools with lots of noise.

I’ve had good results with these:

https://www.flareaudio.com/collections/calmer

(No commercial affiliation)

They’re not completely closed so you don’t get that in the mouth sound. They just turn down the volume a bit and reduce some of the annoying high frequency buzzing that I feel when pitches are too high (for me), like the piccolo and trumpet.

For the tinnitus after noise exposure ( or for different reasons) I use transparent earplugs with three soft lamellae for stronger obturation.
For orchestra I found Sonic Defenders EP3 for avoiding impulse-like impacts from timpani, cymbals etc. These little guys make me hear the rest of the band, not so very much my own playing - as it happens with complete closure.

Wish I wore them that day, see above....

For EP3 and EP4 you may want to visit this link:
https://www.surefire.com/products/earpr ... defenders/

I've worn custom-cast Etymotic plugs for years, after one night playing for Barry White's Love Unlimited Orchestra with wholly inadequate foam plugs supplied by the road crew. At 66, I have tinnitus and a Permanent Threshold Shift at 3k Hz. I recently started using Music Pro Elite plugs, also from Etymotic, and they are an improvement. They have active electronics that allow them to modulate their sound attenuation as ambient sound increases in volume.

I have those - an early version when they first came out. I've only used them on a couple of gigs but really enjoyed them.

I just found the hearing aid batteries hard to handle. I think the current ones are rechargeable so you don't have to change the tiny batteries.

My tinnitus started a couple years ago. Trumpets, drums, cymbals, probably some gun shooting as well, etc... I don't think i have real hearing loss, I can "hear" sounds, but don't recognize them as words. My dad and his mother were both deaf or largely impaired. I have a friend with $5000 hearing aids who plays with them very successfully. Something to look forward to I guess.

Hi all,

Apologies in advance for the long reply here but I think that this is a very important topic. Also, this is my experience and opinion only. Everybody is different and require different options, hence the number of mouthpiece makers out there.

First off, here is the web link to Marshall Chasin, who is one of the world's leading authorities on musician's hearing issues. Well worth the time.
https://www.marshallchasinassociates.ca

I'm still amazed that the majority of musicians do not wear or are not aware of the need for good hearing protection. Lack of education, information, or "real (wo)men don't wear ear plugs" has had a huge negative affect on us. My tinnitus started very abruptly 24 years ago, just one of many continuing issues from a Traumatic Brain Injury. I also have significant hearing loss, mainly in my left ear, a result of playing full-time in an orchestra but also from a completely moronic lead trumpet player who showed his displeasure for receiving complaints about his behaviour by firing off several fortississimo High X's into the back of my head.

There are many options for hearing protection, but brass and wind players have to deal with the "hooty-ness" affect of most ear plugs and often it is a trial-and-error process to get something that works for us. Through Marshall Chasin I had a pair of custom-moulded Etymotic passive ER-15 plugs made, but the sound while I was playing didn't work. These were the best option at the time for passive ear protection, but still were not viable for me. After trying almost everything out there I finally went to the Etymotic Music Pro plugs.

At first I was less than impressed, but after advice from another brass player (NOT the lead trumpet player in question) I did a fair amount of trial-and-error by changing around the various ear tips provided by Etymotic. I found a pair that worked beautifully, where I could hear myself clearly and hear what was going on around me in the music. Although the tiny "10" size batteries were a pain to work with, Etymotic now has new set of Music Pro's out there that are rechargeable.

The biggest concern that I get back regarding the Etymotic's is "But they are so expensive." Sure, the Etymotic Music Pro's are pricey and take some time to acclimatize, but trust me, YOUR HEARING NEVER COMES BACK. There are others who may think that hearing protection is uncool, but preventable hearing loss is even less cool. For less than the price of a custom mouthpiece, a snazzy leadpipe, a Scotty Cameron putter or a used carbon Marcus Bonna case you could actually retain your ability to hear.

I'm now on my second pair of very high-end hearing aids. It got to the point where my most frequent question was "Can you please say that again?" Both Widex Evoke and Phonak Audeo L-90 are excellent for distortion- and artefact-free hearing, including in the Orchestra. However, the $5000-6000 a pair price tag makes the Etymotic's price of $400USD not so bad.

We sort of need to hear when we play the trombone.