Bass Trombone Sound?

[WGWTR180]

Loud? Soft? Not sure if you're being sarcastic to be short and sweet but....

In confused, i'm just giving my personal preferences on Bass Trombone sounds, which dynamic has a lot to do with.

[sf105]

I have not read the full and very long threat (again), but if thinking about great bass trombonists and bass trombone sounds that might not have been mentioned yet:
- Stefan Schulz and Thomas Leyendecker/Berlin Philharmonic

I saw Stefan Shulz give a master class in London and the one of the most impressive things was how clean his sound is.

S

[BrianJohnston]

In confused, i'm just giving my personal preferences on Bass Trombone sounds, which dynamic has a lot to do with.

Alrighty then

[Massimo69]

Hi bass trombone sound in jazz for me are George Roberts, Kenny Shroyer, Bill Reichenbach, Paul Faulise, Tony Studd... You need to hear those... Check out my cds with Bill Reichenbach together ala Jay and Kai two octaves below... Also check my books I will sell directly one of all The jazz bass trombone book by me...
Listen too much and develop your jazz sound in your head... This is more important of all kind of horns and mouthpiece... My personal choice on bass are Conn Elkhart sounds... 62h in first or ala George Roberts 70h... But if you don't have in your mind the real sound you will never found a good horn

[baileyman]

Most important thing about a bass trombone sound is intonation.

Not inclination?

Chris

Time. i submit playing on time is most important because the horn conveys so much rhythmic content. Outa time bass is a disaster.

[ArbanRubank]

Articulation. Good, clean, precise articulation becomes the sound and carries through it. There's nothing worse than hearing flub-flub-flub.

[vetsurginc]

Ben van Dijk, Smooth and clean.

[RustBeltBass]

I realize this conversation has stopped a while ago. I didn’t take part in the conversation before and did not read all of the prior posts but understand if went off the rails for a bit until it came back with some very interesting posts.

Something that I am still amazed by is how one’s taste and preferences can change throughout the years. Several of the trombonists mentioned before were at some point the GOAT for me and I listened to them for hours…until I liked someone else a bit more.

Right now for me the most beautiful playing I listen to on recordings is done by James Markey. He has set the standard for bass trombone playing for years now and his virtuosity and his technical abilities have shocked me many years ago when I first listened to “on base”. However, it was not until about a year ago that I listened and really thought it myself “man, I LOVE his sound”.

Our tastes and preferences continue to develop as long as we try to listen with open ears every day and sometimes we find something new and special in something we have listened to already years ago. It’s beautiful, really.

[MStarke]

One key thought on the general question around bass trombone sound - maybe already adressed by others:
Do trombones (or other instruments) really sound so substantially different if you just take a plain long tone and cut out/eliminate differences in e.g. recording technique, volume, starting/ending the note, vibrato etc.?

Or does the difference that most people hear (mostly) come from articulation, vibrato, other stylistic elements?

I am not saying there is no difference in the pure sound, but I am relatively sure that the majority what we talk about is largely driven by other aspects.

And that also spills over into many equipment discussions. E.g. a smaller/larger mouthpiece probably does have some impact on sound - and we would potentially make a general statement that it "sounds" better/brighter/darker/whatever - but the larger difference that we actually hear may be e.g. the beginning of the note/response that we get, how quickly we get a note to center, how comfortable it is to do things like vibrato, crescendo/decrescendo etc.

[imsevimse]

One key thought on the general question around bass trombone sound - maybe already adressed by others:
Do trombones (or other instruments) really sound so substantially different if you just take a plain long tone and cut out/eliminate differences in e.g. recording technique, volume, starting/ending the note, vibrato etc.?

Or does the difference that most people hear (mostly) come from articulation, vibrato, other stylistic elements?

When I studied trombone at the Royal Academy of Music in Stockholm we did an experiment. A teacher had sounds on a tape recorder where he had cut out the start and the end of a note and then we the students should take a guess on what instrument it was. We couldn't, I mean we were wrong. Couldn't even hear the difference between a violin and a trombone, so yes you are right, the sound needs the start and the end too. Articulation is an important part of the sound...

And that also spills over into many equipment discussions. E.g. a smaller/larger mouthpiece probably does have some impact on sound - and we would potentially make a general statement that it "sounds" better/brighter/darker/whatever - but the larger difference that we actually hear may be e.g. the beginning of the note/response that we get, how quickly we get a note to center, how comfortable it is to do things like vibrato, crescendo/decrescendo etc.

.... and vibrato, dynamics phrasing, and to change or expand a sound and the ability to do music with everything When I think of sound all this is included. It is not just a single sound from a player, and the color change a lot with the dynamics and mood.

/Tom

[MStarke]

Tom, thanks for these points!

That experiment you mentioned is what I remember reading or hearing somewhere before. That the very basic sound of just the sustained note is not very characteristic to differentiate.

And I find it totally normal that what we perceive much more than that as the overall sound and our preferences are build on all of it.

I just wanted to make the point that probably most people saying they prefer the sound of this and that trombone player actually mean many more factors than just the pure sound.

[musicofnote]

Just play!

Your sound is your sound!!!

Yes you should listen the EVERYONE to get a general "sound" idea, but you will never sound like Messers Roberts or Kleinhammer!!

LOL - I think there was a thread on a similar subject awhile ago. I've got several direct comparisons of me playing on different mouthpieces. Subjectively, on my side of the bell, they all sound/"feel" different. Some feel more detached, hard, aggressive. Others sound/"feel" broader yet more powerful, and I feel that legato playing is easier. But ... when I actually listen, no matter if on computer speakers, good stereo speakers or very good cans, I cannot tell without look at the file title what mouthpiece it was. They all sound like me. Good, bad or in-between, it's still me.

That being the case in my case, I go with the most efficient for what I'm playing. If I feel I need more weight/breadth in my sound and more variables in articulations, I go with one mouthpiece. If I feel I need more punch, drive and aggressiveness, I go with another. What comes out the other end however is no different. It's almost depressing, as I'd hoped I could actually objectively change my sound but all I'm changing is how I feel while playing. Which'll have to do.

There is one forum member who is an avid content creator, comparing instruments, mouthpieces etc. He swears he can hear the differences. I guess some can and some can't. I can't with me and ... actually also not with him. That's with one caveat. When I have a few days to get back into tenor, I -can- hear a difference between ME on bass and ME on tenor. With him, I can't hear that difference. I just hear him.

[dukesboneman]

I am primarily a Tenor Trombone player, But I do love playing Bass Trombone when the occasion arises.
When I started taking Bass Trombone seriously I had 3 sounds in my head that I`ve tried to emulate .
When I was in High School I had the privledge of studying for 2 summers with Don Knaub.
So that sound has stuck with me.
Then there were 2 players in Rochester that were FANTASTIC Bass Trombonists who I worked with a lot and LOVED Their sounds. Mike Purdy and Paul Able.
I have worked really hard to get a Nice round deep sound on Bass and try to base my sound on those 3 guys

On a side "note" - I was trying out a friends 72H a while ago and he looks at me and says .
"You have a nice tone, not a real power player. Shouldn`t Bass Trombone always hurt the conductor?"

[Cmillar]

Dave Taylor on pretty much anything he’s been involved with the last 50 years.

Am re-enjoying the great Bob Mintzer Big Band from the ‘80s. Check out Dave ‘s great playing on album ‘Incredible Journey’. It sets a standard

[BrianJohnston]

As of late, Christopher Davis has one of the best bass trombone tones i've ever heard.