Olds Special Questions

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Rich5905
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Olds Special Questions

Post by Rich5905 »

Did the Olds Special trombones ever have the Duo-Octagonal inner slides? I have seen the Olds brochure from the early 70's that has been posted online, and in the description of the Specials in there, it sounds like at that time the Specials did not have Duo-Octagonal slides. I was wondering if maybe the earlier Los Angeles Specials would have had them. In the quality pecking order, where would the Special rate? In the brochure I kind of got the impression the Special might have been considered an "intermediate" or a "step-up" trombone. Is that an accurate impression? Finally, what is the general opinion of the Olds Specials? Good horn, bad horn, avoid at all costs?

I am just a very amateur player and like the Olds trombones mostly because that is what I learned on as a kid. I have been on the lookout for a Los Angeles Olds, and have run across a nice Los Angeles Special. Going back and forth about getting it or holding off in hopes of running across a nice Los Angeles Recording or Super. This Special seems to be quite a bit less expensive than the Los Angeles Recordings or Supers I have seen in similar condition, so it is tempting purely from a price perspective.
mrdeacon
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Re: Olds Special Questions

Post by mrdeacon »

As far as I know they never had Octo slides. The LA one I had from the 50s had round tubes and every Fullerton special I've ever seen has had round tubes. John L if he sees this topic is the man and will know if any were ever produced with them.

How much are you looking to spend on a new horn? Supers and Recording can be had for pretty cheap in good shape in the $300-600 range if you're patient.
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Posaunus
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Re: Olds Special Questions

Post by Posaunus »

As I understand the L.A. Olds trombone "pecking order" – In order of increasing price (not necessarily quality – all Olds trombones were pretty well-made and robust):
• Ambassador (cylindrical slides)
• Special (cylindrical slides)
• Studio (cylindrical)
• Super (duo-octagonal slides)
• Recording (duo-octagonal slides - larger bore)

JohnL will surely have more information if you want it.

Caution about Supers and Recordings: their 16-sided slide tubes are likely to be worn or damaged; they are hard to replace.

Specials were considered a "step-up," or "intermediate" trombone compared to the "student" Ambassador, and the Studio and Super more "professional," with slightly fancier materials. But the basic workmanship and quality were similar. If you like Olds trombones, they are typically pretty affordable, and frequently sold by TromboneChat members.

No harm or shame in owning an Olds Special. You should try to get an Olds 3 mouthpiece – that's what was supplied originally, and what fits best in the Olds receiver. (Other small-shank mouthpieces will work, they just won't fit quite as well.) Playing an old Olds trombone is a fun and inexpensive venture!
biggiesmalls
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Re: Olds Special Questions

Post by biggiesmalls »

Don't let the "intermediate" designation turn you off. Specials can punch far above their weight!

Aaron Chandler in St. Louis (Funky Butt Brass Band/Acme Trombones) has been playing a Special exclusively for a couple of years, after many years of playing a 2B.

I sold a Special to a ska player in Taos this spring, and he loves it. He had previously played a 2B Silversonic for over thirty years.
mlshermancpa
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Re: Olds Special Questions

Post by mlshermancpa »

I have an older Olds Special that I believe dates back to 1946. I paid $100 for the horn, stripped the lacquer myself and paid around $200 for dent work & buffing. The horn looks great and is a very good jazz/big band horn. I put it right up there with my King 2b.
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JohnL
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Re: Olds Special Questions

Post by JohnL »

One of these days I need to put together a timeline of all of the Olds trombone models...

The only Olds models I recall seeing with fluted/duo-octagonal tubes are the Super, Recording, Standard TIS, and Standard (aka Standard Self-Balancing). Never seen a Special, Studio, or Ambassador with anything but round tubes, nor have I seen any sales literature indicating that such was ever offered.

The Special first appeared right after WWII as an economy (but not student) model slotted beneath the Standard. Those early Specials were mostly yellow brass with a little nickel trim. I wouldn't really characterize it as a step-up or intermediate model, as that sort of implies an upgraded student model; Olds didn't have a student model at the time (the Ambassador was introduced a couple years later). It's the same basic design as the Super and the Standard, but executed in less expensive materials or added fanciness. Call it "economy pro".

The yellow brass Special was only made for a few years; it was replaced by the "tri-color" model (the iconic Special, IMHO) - nickel silver bell tail, high copper (looks like maybe 85/15 to me) flare, with the balance of the horn being yellow brass with some nickel silver trim (significantly more than the first version Special). The only really student-ish thing is the one-piece handslide brace borrowed from the Ambassador; otherwise, I'd argue that this version is also more "economy pro" than "step-up/intermediate".

The final iteration of the Special came out in the early 1970's; this one I would characterize as more of an intermediate/step-up instrument (the description in the 1973 catalog pretty well spells it out); basically an A-15 Ambassador with round braces and a nickel plated finish.
Arrowhead
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Re: Olds Special Questions

Post by Arrowhead »

Rich5905 wrote: Mon Nov 09, 2020 6:17 pm Did the Olds Special trombones ever have the Duo-Octagonal inner slides? I have seen the Olds brochure from the early 70's that has been posted online, and in the description of the Specials in there, it sounds like at that time the Specials did not have Duo-Octagonal slides.
The Special never did, but all the old Olds small bore trombones have interchangeable slides and bells. So you can take the slide from a Super and combine it with the bell of a Special. So on and so forth....
modelerdc
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Re: Olds Special Questions

Post by modelerdc »

Where does the Olds "Standard" fit into the Olds line? Thanx.
Arrowhead
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Re: Olds Special Questions

Post by Arrowhead »

modelerdc wrote: Sat Dec 19, 2020 11:32 pm Where does the Olds "Standard" fit into the Olds line? Thanx.
The early Olds line during the L.A. period of 30's and 40's didn't have a definitive "this is just okay" vs "this is the best" sort of ranking system. Not until the student line -Ambassador came about, could you start to put in some sort of order. Anyways, the Standard would be ranked near top of the line for small bore horns. Keep in mind, this is before The Recording came out.
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JohnL
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Re: Olds Special Questions

Post by JohnL »

modelerdc wrote: Sat Dec 19, 2020 11:32 pm Where does the Olds "Standard" fit into the Olds line? Thanx.
Right below the Super. It was replaced by the Studio model.
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