Quick Question Re: Doug Elliot Large Bore

[harrisonreed]

It's probably only a matter of time before I'm playing everything on DE mouthpieces, and I soon would like to branch out and learn some bass bone for my multi track projects. So I thought I would reach out to the community and see what folks might think.

Currently almost all my playing is on small bore gear. That's not by choice, just the way the gig goes (NB: kids, get yourself a 3B and start playing it!). Anyways, this wouldn't have been possible for me without Doug Elliott. If anyone heard the alto recording I did for the previous "abandoned" Christmas video here, I think that the alto mouthpiece that Doug came up with is just incredible. I'd appreciate feedback on that, actually, if anyone thought maybe it sounded off.

Anyways, to get down to it, I'd like probably three mouthpieces to just be done with it and not need to worry about maybe not being able to get what I need later on down the line. Everything would be built off the XT106N (or equivalent) rim. You can treat each number as it's own puzzle to solve.

1. I need a nimble solo/1st trombone large bore piece akin to the Bousfield V3. The V3 is pretty shallow, with a wide entrance to the throat almost like a double cup. Maybe something like the Alessi 1A or 4CL would work too, but the throats on those are ... taxing ... Ideally something between the throat of the V3 and the 1A, but I know that Doug doesn't really do too many custom throats. So hopefully the suggested combo has a throat in between by default. I'm guessing it would be an XT-E cup, with the correct shank for .547. I noticed my alto shank has the inner edge chamfered where it meets the leadpipe. The V3 does too, and it would be cool if the shank for this DE setup did too.

2. I need a solid large ensemble, not soloist, mouthpiece akin to the Alessi 1C. The Bousfield O3 is nice, but when stacked up against the 1C ... everyone votes for the 1C. The 1C has more of a bowl shaped cup than the O3 and a much larger throat. The rim shape is not for me, and it is tiring to play. What might be the DE solution? I'm thinking it probably lies in the new SYM series, but I have no idea. Again, maybe the closest DE setup already has a throat in between the O3 and the 1C.

3. I would like to do some multi tracking stuff on bass, but know nothing about bass playing. I have tried to play some third parts on tenor using the 1C, but it's not good. I'm very much geared towards playing everything in and above the tenor clef, and while I can blast pedals and low stuff convincingly for concertos or solos, I have to concede that in an actual low part it sounds wrong. What all-rounder bass mouthpiece would make sense built off of the 106N?

Thanks for any and all suggestions, including counter-arguements. I'm pretty hung up on my Bousfield V3 and may never give it up, but I have a feeling that now is the time to get DE solutions to the same problems that the V3 and 1C try to tackle.

[Vegasbound]

Why not just talk to Doug?

[Vegasbound]

That said as primarily a tenor player , I use a small bass set up Doug put together for me over 10 years ago akin to a 1 1/2g does everything I need bass wise.

[BGuttman]

I hope Doug checks in, but I think you will need to learn a bigger rim for the bass. The 106 is close to his 1 1/2 G equivalent, but still a little small.

You could probably try a LB J/J8 which would get you into "tweener" territory but I think you will wind up with a larger rim.

For large tenor I would consider an E cup for high parts and a G cup for lower parts. But these are starting points. Wat works for you will work for you and probably won't work for me. I can offer what I do, but I couldn't really be tat good an example.

[harrisonreed]

Nah, this is all good. I made this topic to hear what works for everyone.

[Doug Elliott]

You're on the right track.
XT N106, E, E8
XT or SYM N106, G, G8
SB 106, J, J8 or K, K8 or L, L8
The SB 106 is the same or almost the same as the N106. If your low range is good enough you can use that rim size on bass and depend on the deep cup to get the sound and response.

I think it's all in stock and you're welcome to try it.

[harrisonreed]

Thanks Doug!

[ithinknot]

Everything DE is great and you should get it yesterday.

A question - have you (or how come you haven't) already tried any generic bass mpcs to see how you get on with a slightly larger diameter for that sort of playing?

Bach 1.25G has a nice narrow rim, an 'average modern' diameter without getting into Schilke 60 territory, and a completely MOR depth (equivalent to DE K, I see). It's a cheap experiment. Or at least get an SB 110 rim to try at the same time as the SB 106?

In my very limited bass experience (but as another person who gravitates inside and above and doesn't find large diameter rims to reduce range on alto or tenor), so many aspects of the bass approach require adjustment (mental and physical) that the change of diameter doesn't seem all that 'additionally disturbing'...