Rosolino vs the rest

ttf_BFW
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Rosolino vs the rest

Post by ttf_BFW » Sun Aug 08, 2010 6:50 pm

Parris, while I can sympathize with your desire for accuracy regarding the circumstances of your father's death, I need to remind you that this topic is about Frank Rosolino's music.  We have encouraged people to focus on his musical legacy, or to allow others to do so, without sidetracking every discussion about him by delving into details of his death.  Perhaps you could allow the very positive musical discussion here, including posting of pointers to recordings and videos and discussions of style, to continue, and take the corrections to a different topic?  Perhaps the recently-started discussion of your Facebook page might be a good place?

http://tromboneforum.org/index.php/topic,52697.0.html
ttf_anonymous
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Rosolino vs the rest

Post by ttf_anonymous » Thu Jul 30, 2015 1:03 pm

Wow. I am commenting so members who weren't on the forum at that time can read  it.

Long live frank. May his sublime and raw style live on.
ttf_BackBone
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Rosolino vs the rest

Post by ttf_BackBone » Thu Jul 30, 2015 10:16 pm

Rosolino was a great player. But I feel he speaks at me with his playing not to me. He seems to play like he sings as most great players do. Are there players as good? Yes. Yes. Yes.

Now Big "T" speaks to me. His playing and his singing. Seems the longer I listen, the more I learn from him. Even the band that he plays with has that same conversational style that resonates with me.

Take a listen - really listen:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j9udjEXDpAg

Intro solo... singing... exiting solo (muted)... Yes.

Rosolino was a great player. Those who like him the best will like  him the best. Those who don't... won't. That is ok! Be glad that your favorite player plays in a way that speaks to you. And that you have the ability to appreciate it.

ttf_anonymous
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Rosolino vs the rest

Post by ttf_anonymous » Tue Aug 04, 2015 6:59 am

Quote from: BFW on Aug 08, 2010, 06:50PMParris, while I can sympathize with your desire for accuracy regarding the circumstances of your father's death, I need to remind you that this topic is about Frank Rosolino's music.  We have encouraged people to focus on his musical legacy, or to allow others to do so, without sidetracking every discussion about him by delving into details of his death.  Perhaps you could allow the very positive musical discussion here, including posting of pointers to recordings and videos and discussions of style, to continue, and take the corrections to a different topic?  Perhaps the recently-started discussion of your Facebook page might be a good place?

http://tromboneforum.org/index.php/topic,52697.0.html

News flash: Frank Rosolino was not Parris' father. He was married to her mother but he never adopted her. She changed her last name to Rosolino sometime after his death.
ttf_Paul Martin
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Rosolino vs the rest

Post by ttf_Paul Martin » Tue Aug 11, 2015 1:59 pm

Quote from: sabutin on Oct 31, 2007, 06:34AMWho knows?

It always made me kinda nervous to hear it, that's for sure. Really. The reason that I so prefer the styles of people like Teagarden, Dorsey, Trummy Young, Urbie, J.J. and Jimmy Knepper to those of say Rosolino and Fontana is because of the relatively uninterrupted elegance and cleanliness of the former's lines. Even when they DID play embellishments, it was somehow integral to the melody and unexpected rather than a repeated interjection like someone saying "Y'know what I mean?" 20 times a sentence.

[...]

When I hear that hiccup thing, I just turn off. Always have. I do not care HOW difficult it is. It's still a hiccup.


Amen;  there's a Teagarden recording, might be "Saints," where he plays this amazing lip slur across 4 partials at a blistering pace, in good time, in tune, and the effect in amazing, but I never heard him play anything like that ever again, so he could play all sorts of incredibly technical things, but chose not to.


ttf_fungusbrains2
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Rosolino vs the rest

Post by ttf_fungusbrains2 » Sun Sep 25, 2016 2:36 pm

75 people here think they play better that Rosolino.  You guys' egos are worse than trumpet players!
ttf_growlerbox
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Rosolino vs the rest

Post by ttf_growlerbox » Sun Sep 25, 2016 2:41 pm

Quote from: fungusbrains2 on Sep 25, 2016, 02:36PM75 people here think they play better that Rosolino.  You guys' egos are worse than trumpet players!

Wait ... what?  No they don't.  75 people here think that there are trombone players who play as well or better than Rosolino.  There may be those who include themselves in that august group, but that wasn't an option in the poll.
ttf_fungusbrains2
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Rosolino vs the rest

Post by ttf_fungusbrains2 » Sun Sep 25, 2016 2:42 pm

75 people here think they play better that Rosolino.  You guys' egos are worse than trumpet players!
ttf_slide advantage
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Rosolino vs the rest

Post by ttf_slide advantage » Sun Sep 25, 2016 3:05 pm

I voted no because I was curious to what the percentage was.

But after a certain point, the whole 'who is best' argument is absurd. Jazz improv isn't a sporting event where medals are handed out. Frank played what Frank heard. The same with Carl, Slide, Urbie, Watrous, Al Grey...the list goes on and on.

he certainly is among the top of players who have influenced other players.
ttf_slide advantage
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Rosolino vs the rest

Post by ttf_slide advantage » Sun Sep 25, 2016 3:13 pm

I voted no because I was curious to what the percentage was.

But after a certain point, the whole 'who is best' argument is absurd. Jazz improv isn't a sporting event where medals are handed out. Frank played what Frank heard. The same with Carl, Slide, Urbie, Watrous, Al Grey...the list goes on and on.

he certainly is among the top of players who have influenced other players.
ttf_sonicsilver
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Rosolino vs the rest

Post by ttf_sonicsilver » Sun Sep 25, 2016 4:15 pm

I voted yes because there are many superb jazz trombonists. Not better, not worse. Just different. And Ros was certainly different... Can't choose between chocolate cake and fillet steak and strawberries. All are great. It just depends what you fancy.

There are no sacred cows for me, and I hear things in the big names' playing that I wouldn't want to hear in mine. I try to assimilate the good and guard against the bad, eventually becoming an amalgamation of all the bits I like best. Or that's the plan, anyway. Plus maybe a little bit of something original from me that is my recognisable fingerprint. I probably couldn't hear it myself: it'd have to be pointed out to me by someone who's heard me play a lot.

Regarding the events at the end of Frank Rosolino's life, it's the old debate about mad versus bad. I don't believe he did it out of wickedness, cackling like some evil mastermind, or coldblooded like a sociopath. Neither fits with the personality of the man. I'm not the most sentimental and sympathetic person you'll ever meet, but I do pity anyone in such anguish and turmoil that killing your family and then yourself enters your mind as a possible course.
ttf_Piano man
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Rosolino vs the rest

Post by ttf_Piano man » Sun Sep 25, 2016 5:01 pm

Quote from: fungusbrains2 on Sep 25, 2016, 02:36PM75 people here think they play better that Rosolino.  You guys' egos are worse than trumpet players!

I think you're misreading the poll question. It's meant literally--Do you believe that anyone plays as well as Rosolino?

It's not meant in the colloquial sense--'Can you play as well as Rosolino?"

In other words, it's the difference between asking, "Did anyone hit as well as Ruth" as opposed to "Does anyone have a light?"

If you misread the first question, you'll answer, 'No, I don't hit at all.' If you misread the second, you'll say, "I'm sure someone has a light--there are billions of people on the earth." Context is everything.

I don't think the people answering 'yes' were claiming that they themselves outplay Rosolino, except maybe lately.
ttf_ISAB
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Rosolino vs the rest

Post by ttf_ISAB » Tue Nov 29, 2016 2:20 pm

Nobody even comes close to him
I like listening to Wycliffe Gordon too though
But Rosolino was one of a kind, unique
ttf_greenbean
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Rosolino vs the rest

Post by ttf_greenbean » Tue Nov 29, 2016 2:47 pm

> Nobody even comes close to him

> But ______________ was one of a kind, unique


But these statements are true for countless players!  Scores and scores of players over the years.

ttf_anonymous
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Rosolino vs the rest

Post by ttf_anonymous » Sun Apr 02, 2017 12:40 pm

There is a standard set among jazz musicians that is a rank of sorts. Coltrane bird pops miles cllifford brown Freddy Hubbard woody Shaw  dexter Gordon bud Powell art tatum Roy Eldridge dizzy Lester young Coleman Hawkins and many more. These are the great innovators. As far as trombononist , the cats who played with them are jj curtis slide Teagarden trummy Bennie green . The over reaching factor here is the unknowable factor of artistic integrity. What is this? The music comes first and the technique is an afterthought. I couldn't imagine Teagarden playing with pops and suddenly going off on a barrage of of stupid trombone tricks.jj played with miles and it fit perfectly. Bennie green also played with miles and likewise . Curtis played with bud Powell.  Slide with dexter and so on. This also applies to classical players. Lewis van Haney and Gordon pullis had subtle nuances in their playing that separated them from the others . Their choices in solos tended towards music by real composers i.e. Bach etc. Ralph sauer comes to mind in this genre. Back to jazz and rosolino. Sure he's a unique voice and a great player. Sometimes the technique gets in the way of the music. Perhaps if he were around more of the more mainstream jazzers instead of the west coast crowd , he would have played differently?? Anyway , I don't listen to Frank anymore just like I'd rather listen to Ralph sauer perform the Bach cello suites instead of a technician playing blue bells . Real music moves everyone emotionally
ttf_slide advantage
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Rosolino vs the rest

Post by ttf_slide advantage » Tue Apr 04, 2017 7:02 am

Referring to Rosolino's playing as "stupid trombone tricks" is a little extreme imo. He played what he felt.
ttf_Radar
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Rosolino vs the rest

Post by ttf_Radar » Tue Apr 04, 2017 7:15 am

I admire Rosolino for his technical ability, and he was definately a unique player.  I enjoy listening to a lot of different players, and have my own personal favorite (JJ), but I hesitate to say anyone is the Best or Greatest at an endeavor.  Music is such a subjective subject, and what I think is great the next guy might not like at all.  Lots of great players out there doing very creative things on the instrument, I think it's impossible to single out one player and say he is the all around greatest!!
ttf_slide advantage
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Rosolino vs the rest

Post by ttf_slide advantage » Tue Apr 04, 2017 8:36 am

Quote from: Radar on Apr 04, 2017, 07:15AMI admire Rosolino for his technical ability, and he was definately a unique player.  I enjoy listening to a lot of different players, and have my own personal favorite (JJ), but I hesitate to say anyone is the Best or Greatest at an endeavor.  Music is such a subjective subject, and what I think is great the next guy might not like at all.  Lots of great players out there doing very creative things on the instrument, I think it's impossible to single out one player and say he is the all around greatest!!

Well stated. Music (and arts in general) is not a sporting event where medals are awarded.

Thank God for the variety of styles that players have. I can't imagine everyone playing the same way.
ttf_slide advantage
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Rosolino vs the rest

Post by ttf_slide advantage » Tue Apr 04, 2017 8:36 am

Quote from: Radar on Apr 04, 2017, 07:15AMI admire Rosolino for his technical ability, and he was definately a unique player.  I enjoy listening to a lot of different players, and have my own personal favorite (JJ), but I hesitate to say anyone is the Best or Greatest at an endeavor.  Music is such a subjective subject, and what I think is great the next guy might not like at all.  Lots of great players out there doing very creative things on the instrument, I think it's impossible to single out one player and say he is the all around greatest!!

Well stated. Music (and arts in general) is not a sporting event where medals are awarded.

Thank God for the variety of styles that players have. I can't imagine everyone playing the same way.
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