More YouTube Trombonists

ttf_ntap · Post by **ttf_ntap** » Sun Aug 10, 2008 7:46 pm

Shameless plug -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7MjdVOZT4yU

ttf_anonymous · Post by **ttf_anonymous** » Mon Aug 11, 2008 11:26 am

Speaking of shameless plugs..

The Funderhorns were in the studio yet again this past weekend...here's getting the levels on the mics:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wbsg3t4mOCw

Wes Funderburk
www.funderbone.com

ttf_anonymous · Post by **ttf_anonymous** » Mon Aug 11, 2008 2:36 pm

Quote from: Wes Funderburk on Aug 11, 2008, 11:26AMSpeaking of shameless plugs..

No problem with that.

Your speed is incredible, by the way.

ttf_LX · Post by **ttf_LX** » Mon Aug 11, 2008 10:09 pm

Quote from: DaveAshley on Aug 10, 2008, 07:39PMScott Whitfield with Toshiko Akiyoshi at 4:08 (and some more at the end!)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mu3NrWwLLqo

Thanks for sharing this one, Dave!! His soloing leaves me breathless every time I hear him!! Scott remains a real serious student of the music and is totally fearless!!

And in the 12 years since this concert, he's grown that much more!!

LX

ttf_ctingle · Post by **ttf_ctingle** » Mon Aug 11, 2008 10:25 pm

While I've only spent two weeks over two years time next to Scott, unlike Alex who gets to be next to him on a regular basis, I have to say Scott strikes me as one of the most virtuosic players I've encountered. We were in a Kenton-ish big band situation, and he easily and authoritatively channeled Dick Shearer, then Carl Fontana, then Frank Rosolino.....During one of our daily masterclass sessions, I got him to demonstrate player after player's style, one by one for the students. It was something to witness!

Quote from: LX on Aug 11, 2008, 10:09PMThanks for sharing this one, Dave!! His soloing leaves me breathless every time I hear him!! Scott remains a real serious student of the music and is totally fearless!!

And in the 12 years since this concert, he's grown that much more!!

LX

ttf_LX · Post by **ttf_LX** » Tue Aug 12, 2008 5:32 pm

John Allred absolutely tearing up some blues with Scott Hamilton, Warren Vache and the cats...[John's solo starts around 2:30]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9dZyxW_l4Lw

ttf_huds18425 · Post by **ttf_huds18425** » Tue Aug 12, 2008 7:21 pm

This kid still blows me away. He did a fantastic job on this piece.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2NiRYPsVUn4

ttf_janettem · Post by **ttf_janettem** » Wed Aug 13, 2008 3:51 pm

Quote from: LX on Aug 11, 2008, 10:09PMThanks for sharing this one, Dave!! His soloing leaves me breathless every time I hear him!! Scott remains a real serious student of the music and is totally fearless!!

And in the 12 years since this concert, he's grown that much more!!

LX

Yeah!

Big fan of his,he blows me away...one of my heroes when I picked up the horn again last year!
(And you too,Alex...LOL)

Thanks for sharing,man!

ttf_marty nichols · Post by **ttf_marty nichols** » Thu Aug 14, 2008 8:41 am

Quote from: LX on Aug 12, 2008, 05:32PMJohn Allred absolutely tearing up some blues with Scott Hamilton, Warren Vache and the cats...[John's solo starts around 2:30]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9dZyxW_l4Lw

That tells me what "burnin'" really means. LOL
Wow!
I have seen John Allred play in festivals and his enduranceis very extreme imo.

ttf_LX · Post by **ttf_LX** » Fri Aug 15, 2008 10:49 pm

Quote from: marty nichols on Aug 14, 2008, 08:41AMThat tells me what "burnin'" really means. LOL
Wow!
I have seen John Allred play in festivals and his enduranceis very extreme imo.

Here's another Allred "burner"....

http://www.dailymotion.com/relevance/search/john%2Ballred/video/x3z4cj_what-is-this-thing-called-love-warr_music

Right from the out-set of this solo, he shows how he has been influenced by [but in NO WAY directly repeats!!] the great Frank Rosolino.

He also manages to hold the cats together on the stop time horn blowing!!

ttf_josh roseman · Post by **ttf_josh roseman** » Wed Aug 20, 2008 5:22 pm

Missed this the first time around- but holy moly, what a soulful, stately and organic sound this is...
great chart & conception also-I always appreciate the sound of trombone honing in Coltrane's sphere in this way, it is a natural fit. Awesome, Sam.
j

Quote from: sabutin on Feb 24, 2007, 10:36AMLORD ALMIGHTY!!!!
I had NO IDEA that was made into a video. Thank you SO much!!!
Can't find Cleve Pozar...haven't been able to do a thing with that CD.
All the trombones...that's all me. Played a small axe (Conn Burkle 32H), a .525/.547 and bass. I wrote the chart, too.
Drums? Cleve Pozar...one of my oldest friends...on Santeria ritual drums called bata.
Nice to hear it again.....

ttf_anonymous · Post by **ttf_anonymous** » Wed Aug 20, 2008 6:17 pm

Amazing recordings of an amazing song

Canadian Youth Trombone Quartet
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MtXZIwZ5OfM

The Great Christian Lindberg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9GnJ-xL7n3k

Just for kicks one of the greatest tuba soloist ever Øystein Baadsvik
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fYOsNp4O7AU

ttf_Graham Martin · Post by **ttf_Graham Martin** » Wed Aug 20, 2008 8:15 pm

Quote from: LX on Aug 15, 2008, 10:49PM
Here's another Allred "burner"....

http://www.dailymotion.com/relevance/search/john%2Ballred/video/x3z4cj_what-is-this-thing-called-love-warr_music

Right from the out-set of this solo, he shows how he has been influenced by [but in NO WAY directly repeats!!] the great Frank Rosolino.

He also manages to hold the cats together on the stop time horn blowing!!
I still think there is more Bill than Frank.

ttf_sabutin · Post by **ttf_sabutin** » Wed Aug 20, 2008 9:07 pm

Quote from: josh roseman on Aug 20, 2008, 05:22PMMissed this the first time around- but holy moly, what a soulful, stately and organic sound this is...
great chart & conception also-I always appreciate the sound of trombone honing in Coltrane's sphere in this way, it is a natural fit. Awesome, Sam.
j

Thank you, Josh.

Someday, maybe I'll be able to record the other many hours of music that I have finished and waiting in the depths of my computer. Money is a *****, ain't it?

But as Duke said...

Quote
There is hardly any money interest in art, and music will be there when money is gone.
Yup.

So it goes.

I am glad you liked it. 'Trane changed my life.

S.

ttf_anonymous · Post by **ttf_anonymous** » Fri Aug 22, 2008 6:27 pm

Chuck Findley on slide trumpet:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rcsGttruRd4

....um.........

Wes Funderburk
www.funderbone.com

ttf_slideorama · Post by **ttf_slideorama** » Fri Aug 22, 2008 7:49 pm

Has anyone checked out Max Seigel lately?

If you could go to Chipotle and ask for a little bit of George Robert's style rolled up in Dave Taylor's attitude, a Max Seigel burrito wrapped up in foil is what you would get.

Seigel laying it down.

Dig his website people. If there is a future of the bass trombone, or at least the next few chapters, Seigel is writing the book.

I've had the pleasure of meeting him and performing one of his pieces [Two Drunken Circus Clowns with Girl in Bikini]- besides being on the forefront of trombone playing, his writing is just as refreshing and incredible.

ttf_Bonefide · Post by **ttf_Bonefide** » Fri Aug 22, 2008 11:32 pm

7 a.m. blues anybody?

Hey, the topic isn't "More skilled Youtube Trombonists"...

ttf_anonymous · Post by **ttf_anonymous** » Sun Aug 24, 2008 6:54 am

Quote from: slideorama on Aug 22, 2008, 07:49PMHas anyone checked out Max Seigel lately?

If you could go to Chipotle and ask for a little bit of George Robert's style rolled up in Dave Taylor's attitude, a Max Seigel burrito wrapped up in foil is what you would get.

Seigel laying it down.

Dig his website people. If there is a future of the bass trombone, or at least the next few chapters, Seigel is writing the book.

I've had the pleasure of meeting him and performing one of his pieces [Two Drunken Circus Clowns with Girl in Bikini]- besides being on the forefront of trombone playing, his writing is just as refreshing and incredible.

max is great and completely fluid. but, have any of you been to his midnight basketball hangs up here in the heights?....or late night poker?

dg

ttf_anonymous · Post by **ttf_anonymous** » Sun Aug 24, 2008 11:46 am

I'm not going to scroll through 39 pages to see if this has been posted yet:

Watrous sporting the "haircut" in 1976, "Nancy With the Laughing Face"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jc28xkHzLp8

...awesome.

Wes Funderburk
www.funderbone.com

ttf_griffinben · Post by **ttf_griffinben** » Mon Aug 25, 2008 8:26 am

QuoteQuote from: slideorama on Aug 22, 2008, 09:49PM
Has anyone checked out Max Seigel lately?

If you could go to Chipotle and ask for a little bit of George Robert's style rolled up in Dave Taylor's attitude, a Max Seigel burrito wrapped up in foil is what you would get.

Seigel laying it down.

Dig his website people. If there is a future of the bass trombone, or at least the next few chapters, Seigel is writing the book.

I've had the pleasure of meeting him and performing one of his pieces [Two Drunken Circus Clowns with Girl in Bikini]- besides being on the forefront of trombone playing, his writing is just as refreshing and incredible.

max is great and completely fluid. but, have any of you been to his midnight basketball hangs up here in the heights?....or late night poker?

dg
I keep waiting for people to really catch on to what Max is doing. He is, as far as I know, the ONLY bass trombonist so fluid and immersed in a true jazz aesthetic. Not only modern stuff, but he can SHRED more mainstream changes and jazz styles when called upon to do so. Plus his technique is truly off the map, he is limited only by his imagination, which is vast indeed.

I've sat next to Max over many years and have come to really appreciate not only his sound and pitch, but his musicality is beyond compare...something you don't often hear from about a "jazz" bass trombonist. I know I am not alone in this department. One day Max will catch on BIG (I hope), and we'll all be amazed at this next generation virtuoso musician that happens to play bass trombone.

Not to mention he writes his ass off.

I personally am more of a fan of the PlayStation Grand Theft Auto/Fighter Pilot hangs, but good to know that he's expanding his horizons...

-Ben

ttf_anonymous · Post by **ttf_anonymous** » Wed Aug 27, 2008 7:24 pm

For his age this kid is really good. This piece isn't technically hard it's more of a challenge to get the phrasing just right.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MBFWLRbkUGY

ttf_anonymous · Post by **ttf_anonymous** » Thu Aug 28, 2008 9:14 am

I'm new here and not sure if this has been posted yet but it definitely deserves it just in case. It's a clip from the musical "In The Heights" where Joe Fiedler burns a short solo at about 3:45.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=edtfyZwUrPs

ttf_anonymous · Post by **ttf_anonymous** » Thu Aug 28, 2008 11:10 am

Elliot Mason @55 the Bar with bassist Janek Gwizdala......

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YG3whItC-U0

ttf_DaveAshley · Post by **ttf_DaveAshley** » Wed Sep 10, 2008 1:33 pm

OK I think everyone can agree that George Masso is right on here....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iGhoGQqFE-M

.....and don't just listen to the solo and close it -- check out the last couple of minutes too....

ttf_denny seifried · Post by **ttf_denny seifried** » Wed Sep 10, 2008 2:13 pm

Quote from: DaveAshley on Sep 10, 2008, 01:33PMOK I think everyone can agree that George Masso is right on here....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iGhoGQqFE-M

.....and don't just listen to the solo and close it -- check out the last couple of minutes too....

Dave----what a great video! Thanks for sharing this one with all of us.

The bari-player is very easy to listen-to, also.

As Dave states---don't miss the end! Nice surprise!

ttf_Graham Martin · Post by **ttf_Graham Martin** » Wed Sep 10, 2008 3:33 pm

Quote from: DaveAshley on Sep 10, 2008, 01:33PMOK I think everyone can agree that George Masso is right on here....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iGhoGQqFE-M

.....and don't just listen to the solo and close it -- check out the last couple of minutes too....

One of the best 'hot' trombone players in the world! And check out that European rhythm section.

Just about anything with Lino Patruno leading is going to swing like mad. Thanks Dave, that one goes on the hard drive.

Here is a guy with a good collection of trombone videos. Almost as good as mine.

http://ckuik.wordpress.com/2008/03/02/jazz-trombone-players/

ttf_denny seifried · Post by **ttf_denny seifried** » Wed Sep 10, 2008 4:15 pm

Quote from: Graham Martin on Sep 10, 2008, 03:33PMOne of the best 'hot' trombone players in the world! And check out that European rhythm section.

Just about anything with Lino Patruno leading is going to swing like mad. Thanks Dave, that one goes on the hard drive.

Here is a guy with a good collection of trombone videos. Almost as good as mine.

http://ckuik.wordpress.com/2008/03/02/jazz-trombone-players/

Grah----who is the bari player?

ttf_Graham Martin · Post by **ttf_Graham Martin** » Wed Sep 10, 2008 9:00 pm

Hi Denny,

Just an Italian guy.

Here is his MY SPACE:

http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendID=379210993

In the 70s and 80s he always seemed to be playing an Ernie Carceres kind of role in European Condon style bands - his own Milan College Jazz Society, or with Lino Patruno. But he is obviously not confined to this style as you can tell by the visiting stars he has played with, including Jerry Mulligan. I just love the vibrato!

Here with Wild Bill:

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=LYCBp689Loo

And fifteen years later with Lino and the Jazz Stars of Italy:

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=i2wBrghBINs

And these days he has a nicely matured style, judging by his recent CD Live At il Melo

My kind of bari sax player.

Up there with Ronnie Ross, Joe Temperley, John Barnes and Kathy Stobart!!!

ttf_marty nichols · Post by **ttf_marty nichols** » Tue Sep 16, 2008 4:32 am

Quote from: Graham Martin on Sep 10, 2008, 03:33PMOne of the best 'hot' trombone players in the world! And check out that European rhythm section.

Just about anything with Lino Patruno leading is going to swing like mad. Thanks Dave, that one goes on the hard drive.

Here is a guy with a good collection of trombone videos. Almost as good as mine.

http://ckuik.wordpress.com/2008/03/02/jazz-trombone-players/

I checked the link Grah, when I saw Willie Dennis listed I got all escited (haven't seen or heard him since he was on the recording with JJ, Benny G., Kai, etc. back in the 50's. But all I got when I clicked was a "rapper."

ttf_bobilleg74 · Post by **ttf_bobilleg74** » Fri Sep 19, 2008 3:13 pm

Quote from: Erik Stegall on Aug 28, 2008, 11:10AMElliot Mason @55 the Bar with bassist Janek Gwizdala......

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YG3whItC-U0

Arguably the most progressive jazz trombonist in the world today. Just awesome!

ttf_Trombonaut · Post by **ttf_Trombonaut** » Wed Oct 08, 2008 12:36 am

Bolshoi Theater Orchestra (Moscow) plays Triumphal-funeral symphony by Berlioz (2nd mvt.), trombone-solo - my friend Erkin Yusupov:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wjKBIRpzz8c

ttf_Graham Martin · Post by **ttf_Graham Martin** » Wed Oct 22, 2008 6:40 pm

Ah, one of my favourites. Still! Bob Havens:

http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=vMND7zNvewc

http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=cHu5CA1eRaU

http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=zP7GjVaTJ_c

http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=gnWYQZ7yCVg

http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=YGPb_6AURxw

http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=VTF-GnWhzRY

ttf_DaveAshley · Post by **ttf_DaveAshley** » Fri Oct 24, 2008 2:08 pm

new Frank Rosolino postings! His solos are short, but hey...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4gzwXQGvXgc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lN4CrJ9lyzE

ttf_janettem · Post by **ttf_janettem** » Fri Oct 24, 2008 3:11 pm

Quote from: DaveAshley on Oct 24, 2008, 02:08PMnew Frank Rosolino postings! His solos are short, but hey...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4gzwXQGvXgc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lN4CrJ9lyzE

Just watched them!

So what if they're short,but any Rosolino solo is a great solo!

ttf_anonymous · Post by **ttf_anonymous** » Fri Oct 24, 2008 6:09 pm

Quote from: DaveAshley on Oct 24, 2008, 02:08PMnew Frank Rosolino postings! His solos are short, but hey...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4gzwXQGvXgc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lN4CrJ9lyzE

Brilliant...Richie Kamuca is killin, too. 1958....(sigh)

Wes Funderburk
www.funderbone.com

ttf_DaveAshley · Post by **ttf_DaveAshley** » Sat Oct 25, 2008 8:49 pm

Gary Valente:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a6s0cjSUDJE

ttf_sabutin · Post by **ttf_sabutin** » Sun Oct 26, 2008 2:11 am

Quote from: DaveAshley on Oct 25, 2008, 08:49PMGary Valente:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a6s0cjSUDJE

There is more than one way to skin a cat.

POWER!!!

And soul.

The Preacher preaches.

Do I hear an amen?

I should.

Awesome.

A prodigy of nature.

Awesome.

S.

ttf_anonymous · Post by **ttf_anonymous** » Sun Oct 26, 2008 3:32 am

AMEN!

ttf_The Bone Ranger · Post by **ttf_The Bone Ranger** » Sun Oct 26, 2008 4:25 am

That was my first hearing of Gary Valente, and I as blown away. So much energy, so much soul...

Andrew

ttf_sabutin · Post by **ttf_sabutin** » Sun Oct 26, 2008 4:53 am

Quote from: The Bone Ranger on Oct 26, 2008, 04:25AMThat was my first hearing of Gary Valente, and I as blown away. So much energy, so much soul...

Andrew

Only in a culture this devolved, this decayed could someone who can do what Gary has done on a consistent basis for about 30 years have not been heard at least by all of those who play his instrument.

By more, really, because he transcends "instrument" the way James Brown or Frank Sinatra transcend "singing".

Deep.

Later...

S.

ttf_anonymous · Post by **ttf_anonymous** » Sun Oct 26, 2008 4:54 am

Another 'Amen' Brother

ttf_josh roseman · Post by **ttf_josh roseman** » Thu Nov 13, 2008 4:13 am

gary obviously has sound of the century.
As you check him out closer, you realize he's also a superheavy conceptual player- he really knows how to frame his sound, how to pick and choose moments and so on. His time is unbelievable. I hear a lot of drummer D sharp in him- Gary uses that minimalist/powerful rhythmic stuff that D used to do before he passed in the 80's. they were close. D is missed.

ttf_anonymous · Post by **ttf_anonymous** » Thu Nov 13, 2008 4:16 am

Can I say 'Amen' to that again?

ttf_anonymous · Post by **ttf_anonymous** » Thu Nov 13, 2008 10:27 am

Well, this is supposed to be a discussion group, right? In a discussion, there have to be sides to the argument so, with all respect to Erling and the group and some trepidation, I'll provide one.

You guys are kidding about Valente, right? The sound on the UTube video? Personally, I don't like his sound at all. No, actually, I think it sucks, to be more accurate. I find it irritatingly blatty and with an overblown kazoo edge that might work in fusion (also not my cup-o-tea) or salsa, but is totally inappropriate for jazz. Did I just hear you yell "Somebody Get a Rope?" Well, ok then, since the glass is broken, I don't like the band either. The arrangement is disjointed and the voicing dull.

Please elucidate, what about his sound do you like? Do you aspire to sound like that? Should I?

In contrast may I refer you to Urbie Green, Carl Fontana, JJ, ... just about anybody else?

Or, do I see a trend here, W. Gordon, Marcellus, etc. Please understand, I'm a Standards kind of guy who can appreciate Bop (play it too, mostly) but...JeezLouise, this sound sets me teeth on edge. Am I the fogy here? Honestly, I sure it's my fault but I just can't figure out how.

Standing by to accept incoming,
RD

ttf_sabutin · Post by **ttf_sabutin** » Thu Nov 13, 2008 11:15 am

Quote from: Rob Dorsey on Nov 13, 2008, 10:27AMWell, this is supposed to be a discussion group, right? In a discussion, there have to be sides to the argument so, with all respect to Erling and the group and some trepidation, I'll provide one.

You guys are kidding about Valente, right? The sound on the UTube video? Personally, I don't like his sound at all. No, actually, I think it sucks, to be more accurate. I find it irritatingly blatty and with an overblown kazoo edge that might work in fusion (also not my cup-o-tea) or salsa, but is totally inappropriate for jazz.
It all depends on your definition of "jazz", I guess.

Or maybe of music in general.

And it also depends to some degree on your understanding of the limitations of recording and playback, especially on digital garbage heaps like YouTube. Those of us us who have heard Gary in the flesh understand that his sound is almost unrecordable, and no doubt we are filling in this cartoon of his sound with all of the colors that we know are there from personal experience.

There were those...many of them..who had similarly negative visceral reactions to Louis Armstrong's trumpet sound, and his singing as well. Yet he is generally acknowledged to have invented the "jazz" that you so zealously defend against the depredations of such as Gary Valente.

If Pops stood up in the same scene and played essentially the same part, would he too not be unacceptable to you if you did not know who he was supposed to be?

I think so, myself. He was pretty raunchy as a young player.

QuoteDid I just hear you yell "Somebody Get a Rope?" Well, ok then, since the glass is broken, I don't like the band either. The arrangement is disjointed and the voicing dull.

Please elucidate, what about his sound do you like? Do you aspire to sound like that? Should I?

In contrast may I refer you to Urbie Green, Carl Fontana, JJ, ... just about anybody else?

Or, do I see a trend here, W. Gordon, Marcellus, etc. Please understand, I'm a Standards kind of guy who can appreciate Bop (play it too, mostly) but...JeezLouise, this sound sets me teeth on edge. Am I the fogy here? Honestly, I sure it's my fault but I just can't figure out how.

Standing by to accept incoming,
RD

Yes, Rob. You are the fogy here. The moldy fig as they might have said during the bebop wars of the '40s + '50s. We are in a more inclusive place now. Everybody gets a chance to hear everything coming up now, and Carla was one of the first "jazz" musicians to try and break out of ALL the boxes as a composer. This piece is an attempt...a quite successful attempt, in my opinion...to emulate black church music using the instrumentation of a big band.

Not to somehoiw "civilize" it, but rather to emulate its raw emotional power without talking down to the audience.

Is it "jazz"?

I dunno.

But it sure as hell is music.

is it as refined as the music that you like?

No.

On purpose.

Will it move non-musicians?

OH yes!!!

A whole lot better than any Fontana solo ever played.

Bet on it.

That is not a put down of Carl Fontana, nor am I raising Gary up above him or indeed putting you down.

What do great musicians...and honest listeners as well...hold in common?

Only one thing, really.

They are unabashedly and honestly themselves.

And Gary is more "himself" than possibly any musician with whom I have ever played.

Duke Ellington understood this. That's why he had Johnny Hodges AND Ben Webster, Lawrence Brown AND Tricky Sam Nanton in the same sections.

As the French say:

Vive la difference!!!

And as Duke regularly said (It was his highest compliment.):

QuoteBeyond category!
Yup.

Gary...and Carla too...are both beyond category.

Bet on it.

Later...

S.

ttf_Graham Martin · Post by **ttf_Graham Martin** » Thu Nov 13, 2008 12:11 pm

I guess I will have to bow to the opinions of those people who have heard Gary Valente in the flesh but, on the poor evidence of YouTube, I have got to say I agree with Rob. And he does sound very similar on this other YouTube I found:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QGDTfVIKr-Q

Talking of Louis, Gary's half growl tone sounds very much like Kid Ory. And the improvisation technique is very similar also.

I never have liked Carla Bley small or big bands but surely that YouTube is Funk and not Bop?

I'm not impressed with what I have heard but have an open mind. Has he made anything that I could check out where he did record well?

Hey, Urbie is great but I'm not a big Fontana fan either.

ttf_anonymous · Post by **ttf_anonymous** » Thu Nov 13, 2008 3:53 pm

Carla and Valente (and not only them) are originals beyond category like Sam (Sabutin) states above. It might not be in your personal stylistic/sound bag. But it is so much more than a bag. It's MUSIC BEYOND CATEGORIZATION. It has its own rules, no, create is own rules. Is its own rules. Whether you like it or not. And nobody HAS to like it. Its still ******* fantastic whether we like it or not, for personal/taste reasons. Bet on it - to quote our own Sam.

ttf_janettem · Post by **ttf_janettem** » Thu Nov 13, 2008 4:37 pm

Yes,both Gary and Carla are "outside the box".

What's wrong with that?

They-to use a term that I have come to use more than a few times-are pushing the envelope.

I think that's a good thing!

Remember Bird and Dizzy and JJ back in the day pushed that envelope too when bebop started. Ditto for Miles when Bitches Brew came out.

Need I say more?

ttf_anonymous · Post by **ttf_anonymous** » Thu Nov 13, 2008 4:49 pm

music is a language. to pay too much attention to the quality of someone's voice is to miss the spirit of their words. it is to lose the rhythm of their message. but, different strokes.....

i think it's unfortunate that music education has encouraged the narcissistic attention to the sound of one's voice and the contrived comparisons that often result.

katherine hepburn won a best actress oscar for 'on golden pond'. hmmmmm.....i'm sure there were those that couldn't get past her voice either. too bad for them.

dg

ttf_josh roseman · Post by **ttf_josh roseman** » Thu Nov 13, 2008 4:57 pm

Gary's voice in full bloom is on the outer edge of what's physically possible on the instrument.
more, it's on the edge of what's acoustically possible in a room. He melts microphones, they wither in shame and forget what they were doing when he plays.

If you hear him in a room, if you get the chance to play with him as many of us have- you'll know you're dealing with a heavyweight champion.
Not just his sound, facility and execution- but the conceptual strength and originality of his whole presentation & the spirit behind it. He's coming out of everyone from Kid Ory, Buster Cooper, Bill Hariss and (especially) Rosewell- but he's a true innovator. He has a way of influencing any musician he comes in contact with by sheer force of gravity- you can actually watch section players, drummers, saxophonists get assimilated into "the borg" when he's around.

In truth, he was directly responsible for my switch to a .547 as a kid- after him, there's very little else that interests me about smaller bore instruments.