TromboneChat

What is the darkest sounding trombone anyone has played?

Red brass 88H, on the opening of the Weber Romance.

Years ago, I played a friends old Conn student model with a copper bell (sorry, I can't remember the model number).

Really dark, even at loud volumes, but not 'dull', if that makes any sense. Great fun to play in isolation, but I think it would struggle to cut through in a band.

There's a tendency for some to reach for extremes. I don't think "the darkest" sound is a good sound. The ends of the bell curve are the least popular for a reason.

The darkest trombone I've played was probably a Holton 181 bass, and yes, I'd call it dull and woofy. Hard to play, sounds like a euphonium without the resonance. Extremely dark is not a good thing.

There is also such a thing as too bright at the other end of the spectrum. The brightest horn I've played was a Kanstul 760. Really no fun to play, and an annoying sound.

I think that if you find "the darkest trombone" you'll find that you really don't like that as much as you thought you would.

Conn coprion bells i guess are pretty dark sounding.

If you mean tenor trombone, the darkest sounding I have tried is a large bore silverplated Sovereign with Hagmann.

Unfortunately, its intonation is funny, the response is heavy and woofy, and the sound between dark and dull.

Cant be used for much serious trombone playing, IMHO.

The darkest sounding tenor trombone I know of which actually plays really well is the Yamaha YSL-682B Bousfield. I like it very much.

I played an All Red Brass 8H (Bell, hand slide, tuning slide and goose neck) at Dillon`s years ago.
It had the most beautiful lush Dark sound but like soseggnchips said
It was fun to play in isolation but I think it would get lost in an ensemble
But what a sound.

dukesboneman wrote: ↑Sat Jun 05, 2021 1:39 pm I played an All Red Brass 8H (Bell, hand slide, tuning slide and goose neck) at Dillon`s years ago.
It had the most beautiful lush Dark sound but like soseggnchips said
It was fun to play in isolation but I think it would get lost in an ensemble
But what a sound.

If that was an old one from the twenties, it needs the right mouthpiece... Not all will work... I use a "Marcellus" or a Conn Remington.. A Bach G piece would probably not work well (If You want a sound that blends)

Of the tenor trombones I’ve played for anything more than a quick demo in a shop, the Holton TR-150 is the darkest sounding I‘ve played. It‘s also surprisingly responsive for a 9“ bell.

I disagree about the corprions. I'd love to pick one up again and have it as an option on one of my horns, but in my experience, the copper bells were extremely bright when loud. But I'm also a really, really bright player.

A few years ago a Dillon, they had a heavily modified Bach 50 on display. Thein/Hagmann valves... a dog chew toy bone that had been shaped to be like the Greenhoe thumbrest, as well as few other spots. And I want to say a 562/578 from... Edwards? Anyway, that horn was killer but out of my budget at the time. One of the oddest, yet best playing horns I've ever got my hands on. Very, very dark though.

Matt K wrote: ↑Sat Jun 05, 2021 3:39 pm I disagree about the corprions. I'd love to pick one up again and have it as an option on one of my horns, but in my experience, the copper bells were extremely bright when loud. But I'm also a really, really bright player.

A few years ago a Dillon, they had a heavily modified Bach 50 on display. Thein/Hagmann valves... a dog chew toy bone that had been shaped to be like the Greenhoe thumbrest, as well as few other spots. And I want to say a 562/578 from... Edwards? Anyway, that horn was killer but out of my budget at the time. One of the oddest, yet best playing horns I've ever got my hands on. Very, very dark though.

When putting the Coprion bells to task they brightened up i agree. When it got to that point i was still out of the color spectrum of the groups i used it in.

I played a Thein with a .508-.525 slide with a large shank and a 9" bell that was easily the darkest and most nimble horn I've ever played. Spectacularly dark and nimble. I don't know how I'd use it, but it was really good at what it was good at!

A long time ago I played a Bach 50B2 for a while that was very dark. I loved the sound but it was hard to push it brighter. When I got the bell stripped that helped it to open up more and be less resistant. The darkest horn I've ever played though was a Bach 42G in silver plate. It was at a music shop owned by friend of mine. I think someone had special ordered it and to me it was too dark. One would have had to balance it with the right mouthpiece or something to make it sound more like a trombone.

The whole point of "darkness" is to avoid crass edge when things get really loud. In an orchestra especially you try to be loud without blaring edge. Darkness in itself is not a quality to be sought after.

In non-classical music, the brightness is what allows you to cut through the rest of the band. When you play something like a 42b on lead in a big band, you can play loud, but you're still hard to hear.

I try to get setups that straddle the center of the darkness spectrum so I'm not too dark at low volume or too bright at high volume. And I tend to play bigger bore horns for orchestral, smaller for chamber music and jazz/pop styles to keep the sound centered as much as possible. Mouthpiece /leadpipe choices have a big effect as well.

Inderbinen bells. “Dark” to me, like others have written, means no edges. To me, the sound almost becomes wooden, taking on characteristics of a cello, but not having the body, materials, and build of a cello that allows it to resonate harmonically to play in diverse styles. The end result, to my ear, sounds hollow, maybe with a little edge in the upper harmonics. That’s all you end up hearing because the “darkest” sound is swallowed up or negated by anything in the musical texture that has an edge. The ear forgets that it is there. The end result is an instrument that sounds beautiful alone, but with very few musical contexts that it feels appropriate in with other sounds or musicians present. Also have experienced this with the larger bore Williams horns. Wooden sounds great in theory, but in practice moves too far away from what makes a trombone a trombone. But as others have said, mouthpiece really helps balance everything out.

I have a Selmer Paris Largo 4894 with a 9” bell small shank. That bone is the darkest sound I play went I was young

The darkest sounding trombone I've played was a 42 with an aftermarket Thayer valve. To me, it was too dark, and I ended up selling it to a guy who was doing orchestral auditions. He seemed quite pleased with it.

If anyone wants to try with an Edwards that has the harmonic pillars, try the "2" copper pillar on the bell side, facing out towards the bell, and the long copper pillar, in the middle hole, facing towards the bell, but screwed all the way in as far as it goes.

Very dark, very open feeling.

When I first got a pillar thing on my Edwards, I was skeptical. So I tried a 3 inch steel bolt.
Terrifyingly dark.
Also made the point, if you can wreck it with something, then it can be help with the same.

My 1970's 42B. Dark and frumpy.

Matt K wrote: ↑Sat Jun 05, 2021 3:39 pm I disagree about the corprions. I'd love to pick one up again and have it as an option on one of my horns, but in my experience, the copper bells were extremely bright when loud. But I'm also a really, really bright player.

That was my experience as well. A few years back I ran across a Conn 18H with the coprion bell. I liked the sound and the thing was like a laser beam when you put the foot on the gas. But I didn't have a need for it at the time, so I passed it on to a friend for his band program.

--Andy in OKC