TromboneChat

After playing bass trombone for several years in high school I feel as though I need to get my own instrument as I am unable to use school hardware any longer. With my goal being playing in community bands, what would you all suggest I purchase for an intermediate bass trombone with the money I have saved through work and any other cash I might be able to acquire in the upcoming year?

I'd pick up a used professional single valve bass. Definitely more bang for the buck AND you'll get better resale when you sell it. Intermediate horns... are... IMHO a waist of money.

What you really need to do is decide on what your budget is, and what type of bass trombone you want to get.

tbonesullivan wrote: ↑Wed Nov 02, 2022 8:55 pm I'd pick up a used professional single valve bass. Definitely more bang for the buck AND you'll get better resale when you sell it.

I'd have to disagree there. The used single market is very, very slow. Doubles are always in demand, almost no matter what the level, not to mention them just being a better buy for someone that needs a bass trombone anyway.

Burgerbob wrote: ↑Wed Nov 02, 2022 9:12 pm

tbonesullivan wrote: ↑Wed Nov 02, 2022 8:55 pm I'd pick up a used professional single valve bass. Definitely more bang for the buck AND you'll get better resale when you sell it.

I'd have to disagree there. The used single market is very, very slow. Doubles are always in demand, almost no matter what the level, not to mention them just being a better buy for someone that needs a bass trombone anyway.

What brand or model would you propose, I was looking at the TBQ36YA from Shires but am uncertain as I don't see much about it online. Any brands I should stay away from?

Burgerbob wrote: ↑Wed Nov 02, 2022 9:12 pmI'd have to disagree there. The used single market is very, very slow. Doubles are always in demand, almost no matter what the level, not to mention them just being a better buy for someone that needs a bass trombone anyway.

I was thinking more that most "intermediate" horns are usually single valve basses.

I wasn't aware they were looking at a Q series TBQ36YA, which I really don't consider "intermediate" in the traditional sense.

blicky93 wrote: ↑Wed Nov 02, 2022 9:53 pm

Burgerbob wrote: ↑Wed Nov 02, 2022 9:12 pm

I'd have to disagree there. The used single market is very, very slow. Doubles are always in demand, almost no matter what the level, not to mention them just being a better buy for someone that needs a bass trombone anyway.

What brand or model would you propose, I was looking at the TBQ36YA from Shires but am uncertain as I don't see much about it online. Any brands I should stay away from?

I know several "pros" who use the Shires Q FWIW. Try one if you can but I don't think you can go wrong with what you're looking for.

Also I just noticed an Edwards Used bass trombone here on the classifieds. It's only a few dollars more than a Q series. (I have no connection to the Edwards listed on the classifieds).

Q series Shires are definitely not intermediate. The 2nd trombonist in my orchestra plays a Q, and it's every bit as well made as the custom series.

The Q series Shires are excellent.

Another way to go is a used older instrument. Some Holton TR-180 and 181 models are fantastic.

tbonesullivan wrote: ↑Thu Nov 03, 2022 6:43 am

Burgerbob wrote: ↑Wed Nov 02, 2022 9:12 pmI'd have to disagree there. The used single market is very, very slow. Doubles are always in demand, almost no matter what the level, not to mention them just being a better buy for someone that needs a bass trombone anyway.

I was thinking more that most "intermediate" horns are usually single valve basses.

I wasn't aware they were looking at a Q series TBQ36YA, which I really don't consider "intermediate" in the traditional sense.

You're completely right about them not being intermediate, but after seeing Burgerbob's comment about the used single market being slow I figured I might not be able a second hand trombone for a decent price in any reasonable period of time. Due to those factors I was driven towards the TBQ36YA or the rotor valve variant as I figured I might be able to find one for a decent price on the used market and it would more than sufficient for a very long time. Also, would you mind helping me find the different between their TBQ36G and TBQ36Y?

blicky93 wrote: ↑Thu Nov 03, 2022 5:50 pm
Also, would you mind helping me find the different between their TBQ36G and TBQ36Y?

G has a gold bell, the Y has a yellow bell. Honestly, there won't be much difference between the two- I might recommend the yellow just because it's the more standard choice.

You also want to decide on dependent versus independent set up. I learned on a Holton 169, then 180 that was a Dillon used instrument. Have since switched to an independent (Rath) and really like the choices it offers.

blicky93 wrote: ↑Thu Nov 03, 2022 5:50 pmYou're completely right about them not being intermediate, but after seeing Burgerbob's comment about the used single market being slow I figured I might not be able a second hand trombone for a decent price in any reasonable period of time. Due to those factors I was driven towards the TBQ36YA or the rotor valve variant as I figured I might be able to find one for a decent price on the used market and it would more than sufficient for a very long time. Also, would you mind helping me find the different between their TBQ36G and TBQ36Y?

Are you going to be able to go and try out specific horns, or are you going to be shopping online and having a horn shipped to you? I only ask because right now there are a lot of "open box" and "demo" instruments on the market, while there are really not many used bass trombones out there of any type right now at the major dealers.

Burgerbob wrote: ↑Wed Nov 02, 2022 9:12 pm

tbonesullivan wrote: ↑Wed Nov 02, 2022 8:55 pm I'd pick up a used professional single valve bass. Definitely more bang for the buck AND you'll get better resale when you sell it.

I'd have to disagree there. The used single market is very, very slow. Doubles are always in demand, almost no matter what the level, not to mention them just being a better buy for someone that needs a bass trombone anyway.

To be fair to tbonesullivan, I think he meant that there is (in general) a better resale market for professional trombones than for "intermediate" trombones; not for single-valve vs double-valve basses!

If the budget would cover a brand new Shires Q-series, wouldn‘t it also cover a nice used or ex-demo/open-box Bach, Conn, Yamaha, Benge, King or Courtois double-valved bass?

For example there‘s a Courtois NY bass with screw bell, two slides, Hagmann valves and a Marcus Bonna case at the Brass Ark for about $4.5k, or a Bach 50 BGL3 for $2.6k at the same place. Seems unlikely that the resale value of those would decrease much.

There might be similar deals to be had at places such as Brass Exchange and Dillons with some patience, not to mention the classifieds on here also.

Posaunus wrote: ↑Fri Nov 04, 2022 3:31 pm

Burgerbob wrote: ↑Wed Nov 02, 2022 9:12 pm

I'd have to disagree there. The used single market is very, very slow. Doubles are always in demand, almost no matter what the level, not to mention them just being a better buy for someone that needs a bass trombone anyway.

To be fair to tbonesullivan, I think he meant that there is (in general) a better resale market for professional trombones than for "intermediate" trombones; not for single-valve vs double-valve basses!

For basses, not really. Almost any double valve bass trombone is worth $2k and up, discounting the obvious garbage ones. Some pro singles can't even get close!

How about the Wessex "Stearn" model? I'm really interested in getting one at some point, and the price is great!

If the used single market is indeed "slow" that suggests decent used horns should be obtainable inexpensively. A look at used bass trombones on ebay supports this. If one should decide to sell a used horn, the further depreciation of a 2x used horn will not be much beyond a 1x used horn.

The need for a double will be rare in typical community band-level literature.

I've played in "community bands" - as well as professional wind ensembles. The need for a double-valve bass trombone in such groups (not academic ensembles where "modern" literature is more likely to be explored) is very low. And, as noted, the price of a very good used "professional" single-valve bass trombone is likely to be quite affordable relative to even an "intermediate" double valve bass.

Perhaps I'm too old and out of touch, but I expect the OP (a recent high school graduate with no intention of entering a music conservatory) would be quite happy with a good used single-valve bass trombone for his intended use. Of course if he already loves playing a double-valve, and has the extra $$, he should indeed purchase the best double he can afford.

I’ve had a few bass bones over the years: Holton 181, Conn 62H, an Edwards, Getzen 1052 and 1062, Shires, Bach 50B, a Yamaha 620, and my current horn, a Benge 290. None were new. The Edwards was a heavy set-up with Thayers that needed a lot of attention. I don’t remember the Holton with much fondness. But generally all were decent horns and I can’t say any horn stands out as being significantly better than the rest. Which may simply be a reflection on my playing ability. But I’ve stopped with the Holy Grail thinking.

So, my take: find a quality used double-valve bass that is mechanically sound (or can be put into good playing condition for a reasonable price) and just play.

You can do some effective research by monitoring the Dillon's website, which has a nice listing of bass trombones. They often have some nice used deals:

https://www.dillonmusic.com/brass/tromb ... =12&mode=4

FWIW, based on your stated intentions:
1. Get a double trigger horn, so you don't have to re-tune in order to hit a low C or B natural (Yes, I know that's a rarity in a community band, but who knows, you might end up playing tuba parts sometimes).

2. Inline triggers are not a necessity. In the decades that I have played, I have never come across the need for it. Yes it can be a plus, but the repertoire you are likely to encounter will not need in-lines.

As you progress, you can always "upgrade" yourself to something else as you mature.

G' luck

tbonesullivan wrote: ↑Fri Nov 04, 2022 7:36 am

blicky93 wrote: ↑Thu Nov 03, 2022 5:50 pmYou're completely right about them not being intermediate, but after seeing Burgerbob's comment about the used single market being slow I figured I might not be able a second hand trombone for a decent price in any reasonable period of time. Due to those factors I was driven towards the TBQ36YA or the rotor valve variant as I figured I might be able to find one for a decent price on the used market and it would more than sufficient for a very long time. Also, would you mind helping me find the different between their TBQ36G and TBQ36Y?

Are you going to be able to go and try out specific horns, or are you going to be shopping online and having a horn shipped to you? I only ask because right now there are a lot of "open box" and "demo" instruments on the market, while there are really not many used bass trombones out there of any type right now at the major dealers.

I'm not certain at the moment, this is the first time I've been seriously looking at buying an instrument so I'm new to all the options. Any online stores you would recommend or places that you would suggest demoing instruments in person?

Quinn has a open box Bach bass trombone worth the money at brass and winds. Dillon’s sold me a King Duo-Gravis 20 years ago that worked out great. I still have it and play it. Doug Bart is good at Brass Exchange. He has a Holton. The Horn Guys always treated me right. Wichita Band Instrument has always treated me right.

blicky93 wrote: ↑Sat Nov 05, 2022 11:54 amI'm not certain at the moment, this is the first time I've been seriously looking at buying an instrument so I'm new to all the options. Any online stores you would recommend or places that you would suggest demoing instruments in person?

Where are you located? Most of the places I know to demo horns are on the East Coast of the USA: Dillon Music and Baltimore Brass.

After 35+ years on double trigger basses I've downsized to a single due to injury. To be honest I don't miss the 2nd trigger.
With practice you can get the low C & B without moving the F tuning slide.

I did send you an email.

tbonesullivan wrote: ↑Sat Nov 05, 2022 2:11 pm

blicky93 wrote: ↑Sat Nov 05, 2022 11:54 amI'm not certain at the moment, this is the first time I've been seriously looking at buying an instrument so I'm new to all the options. Any online stores you would recommend or places that you would suggest demoing instruments in person?

Where are you located? Most of the places I know to demo horns are on the East Coast of the USA: Dillon Music and Baltimore Brass.

I’m located in Northern California

Eric Hand in the Bay Area, Horn Guys in LA.

Contact Eric Hand at Park Ave Music in San Jose.