TromboneChat

The Ultimate Brass tenor blanks are nearly identical to GBs.

So are Warburton blanks. But they're not the same on the inside where it matters.

Burgerbob wrote: ↑Sun Dec 25, 2022 3:47 pm So are Warburton blanks. But they're not the same on the inside where it matters.

Yes, it’s the inside that matters most—inside the rim, cup size and shape, throat and backbore.

I used to play a Monette 5 somethingorother. David was talking to me and said something like, “It’s the guts that matter,” while he was pointing to the throat and backbore. I don’t play a Monette mpc anymore, but I do think the throat and backbore are critical.

I also think it’s funny that to skeletonize a mouthpiece, you change the outer shape. That is, you change the exo-skeleton. You know, the EXO-skeleton? Like an insect?

Kbiggs wrote: ↑Sun Dec 25, 2022 5:43 pm

Burgerbob wrote: ↑Sun Dec 25, 2022 3:47 pm So are Warburton blanks. But they're not the same on the inside where it matters.

Yes, it’s the inside that matters most—inside the rim, cup size and shape, throat and backbore.

I used to play a Monette 5 somethingorother. David was talking to me and said something like, “It’s the guts that matter,” while he was pointing to the throat and backbore. I don’t play a Monette mpc anymore, but I do think the throat and backbore are critical.

That's actually a little funny to me, I seem to recall Dave's reaction to some of the copies being that there's some kind of secret stuff they do that the copies don't get. I've seen theories ranging from slightly different source material to heat/annealing treatments and cyro freezing. I can't remember where I got the impression that he claimed that though, but the theories definitely are out there if you look through trumpet herald.

Matt K wrote: ↑Mon Dec 26, 2022 7:13 am

Kbiggs wrote: ↑Sun Dec 25, 2022 5:43 pm

Yes, it’s the inside that matters most—inside the rim, cup size and shape, throat and backbore.

I used to play a Monette 5 somethingorother. David was talking to me and said something like, “It’s the guts that matter,” while he was pointing to the throat and backbore. I don’t play a Monette mpc anymore, but I do think the throat and backbore are critical.

That's actually a little funny to me, I seem to recall Dave's reaction to some of the copies being that there's some kind of secret stuff they do that the copies don't get. I've seen theories ranging from slightly different source material to heat/annealing treatments and cyro freezing. I can't remember where I got the impression that he claimed that though, but the theories definitely are out there if you look through trumpet herald.

I’m sure there’s other stuff to it, as well. Nevertheless, when I played that Monette 5, I was in a quintet with two trumpet players who worked there. We occasionally rehearsed in their workshop. They had some unusual looking equipment there (for a trumpet maker). When I would ask them about this or that piece of equipment that didn’t look like a lathe, a bending bench, etc., I was met with a blank expression and the response, “That’s equipment we use to make trumpets.” I believe they were sworn to secrecy.

Kbiggs wrote: ↑Mon Dec 26, 2022 11:59 am When I would ask them about this or that piece of equipment that didn’t look like a lathe, a bending bench, etc., I was met with a blank expression and the response, “That’s equipment we use to make trumpets.” I believe they were sworn to secrecy.

You're reading way too much into this. That's just where they kept all the money.

(The whole TOP SECRET shtick is great. There's a pretty finite list of significant things one can do to brass, especially once there's solder nearby, but the combination of low intrigue and "discussably high" pricing essentially guarantees free advertising in perpetuity.)

Are you saying that rubbing my mouthpieces with peanut butter might be counterproductive? Ah! I gave away my secret!

Peanut butter makes my mouthpieces too slippery.
That's why I switched to honey.
But I've never before told anyone this secret.
Now I'll have to stop asking for higher pay for my gigs.

The lampshade double bell trumpet schtick WAS a top secret technique. That's what those machines were for.

https://www.monette.net/decorated-horns

ithinknot wrote: ↑Mon Dec 26, 2022 12:26 pm
You're reading way too much into this. That's just where they kept all the money.

Now THAT’S funny!

ithinknot wrote: ↑Mon Dec 26, 2022 12:26 pm (The whole TOP SECRET shtick is great. There's a pretty finite list of significant things one can do to brass, especially once there's solder nearby, but the combination of low intrigue and "discussably high" pricing essentially guarantees free advertising in perpetuity.)

Yes. There are several companies out there that have copied (reverse engineered, maybe) Monette’s designs. I haven’t heard how they compare. Some of the equipment that I COULD identify was a kiln, and what looked like a large refrigeration unit.

Every brass instrument maker—heck, every instrument maker—has an idea, an aesthetic of what they want their instruments to do and how they want them to sound. Some people sound better on a Bach than Conn, a Shires vs. an Edwards, etc. Sometimes, we play what other people play because there are people with influence who “hear with their eyes.” But this has been a lengthy tangent…

To the OP: yes, Ultimate and GB’s have similar exoskeletons. Whether they are similar inside, whether they sound the same, and whether Ultimate Brass mpcs are right for you is another question. Only you, your teacher, and trusted colleagues will have a useful opinion.