TromboneChat

I was wondering what y’all’s opinion is on a question. I am an ex-tuba player. I started on trumpet in 4th grade, switched to baritone in 7th grade and then tuba in HS and the Army Band. I played tuba and a little bass bone in community bands for years. I stopped playing because of loosing my upper teeth in a motorcycle accident in 2010. I started playing again the beginning of 2023. I tried playing tuba and bass bone again, but because of the dentures I had to create an entirely new embouchure and found that my embouchure is best suited for a small bore tenor instead. My question is, since I never studied or took lessons on the slide trombone, should I take lessons and practice on a small bore straight tenor, to get my slide positions mastered, instead of a small bore with F attachment?

The F attachment should make no difference. If you don't use the trigger, it is just like a straight horn. Just don't use the F trigger until you have 6th and 7th positions mastered.

Don't forget 5th position! That's arguably the most difficult to play in tune - it's kind of out in the middle of nowhere.

JeffBone44 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 15, 2023 2:36 pm Don't forget 5th position! That's arguably the most difficult to play in tune - it's kind of out in the middle of nowhere.

Thanks

Kingfan wrote: ↑Sat Dec 09, 2023 10:51 am The F attachment should make no difference. If you don't use the trigger, it is just like a straight horn. Just don't use the F trigger until you have 6th and 7th positions mastered.

Thanks

Just would like to add that it is not a problem with a “medium bore” 0.547 either. It seems to be a back bore mouthpiece issue for me. I am getting a King 4B from my wife for Christmas and switching to the Bach 5G large shank mouthpiece. Thank you for the responses. My only other question is that I would like to get a funnel shaped mouthpiece instead of the cup type Bach makes. Any suggestions? Something similar to the rim, back bore and depth of the 5G? Thanks

0.547" (13.9 mm) is hardly "medium bore". It is Large Bore (Symphonic bore). Medium bore is 0.525" (13.2 mm).

You may have a problem trying to find a conical bore mouthpiece. I'm not sure if there are any readily available. Someone made a "Helleberg" trombone mouthpiece, but I don't know much about it. Helleberg mouthpieces are more conical (at least the tuba ones are).

A Christian Lindberg mouthpiece is pretty funnel shaped, so for a large bore instrument a 5CL or 4CL. They are a bit marmite, either like them or hate them.

StephenK wrote: ↑Fri Dec 15, 2023 4:05 pm A Christian Lindberg mouthpiece is pretty funnel shaped, so for a large bore instrument a 5CL or 4CL. They are a bit marmite, either like them or hate them.

Don't confuse the outside with the inside. The Lindberg has a funnel-shaped outer, but has a modified bowl inner. It's actually not that different from a Bach cup, although the aperture is much larger. Also, the rim is relatively thin compared to a Bach mouthpiece, which some feel makes them a "cookie cutter". I use my 4CL from time to time with good results in my Holton TR-680.

BGuttman wrote: ↑Fri Dec 15, 2023 3:38 pm 0.547" (13.9 mm) is hardly "medium bore". It is Large Bore (Symphonic bore). Medium bore is 0.525" (13.2 mm).

You may have a problem trying to find a conical bore mouthpiece. I'm not sure if there are any readily available. Someone made a "Helleberg" trombone mouthpiece, but I don't know much about it. Helleberg mouthpieces are more conical (at least the tuba ones are).

I have had people in the business tell me that the large bore is 0.563 and up and that 0.525 to 0.547 are “medium/ medium large bore”, I am no technical equipment expert so please forgive the semantics. My YSL-3530R is a dual bore, 0.500/0.525, so I think some call it “small/medium bore”

BGuttman wrote: ↑Fri Dec 15, 2023 5:13 pm

StephenK wrote: ↑Fri Dec 15, 2023 4:05 pm A Christian Lindberg mouthpiece is pretty funnel shaped, so for a large bore instrument a 5CL or 4CL. They are a bit marmite, either like them or hate them.

Don't confuse the outside with the inside. The Lindberg has a funnel-shaped outer, but has a modified bowl inner. It's actually not that different from a Bach cup, although the aperture is much larger. Also, the rim is relatively thin compared to a Bach mouthpiece, which some feel makes them a "cookie cutter". I use my 4CL from time to time with good results in my Holton TR-680.

Which “conical” mouthpiece did JJ Johnson use?

I like the Bach rims and back bores better than the Yamaha rims and back bores, which are the only ones I have tried. I realize that is entirely subjective. Btw, is 0.525 or 0.547 bore the switch between small shank to large shank mouthpieces?

Sort of. 525 bores are mostly small shank, but some makers offer a large shank leadpipe option.

Matt K wrote: ↑Fri Dec 15, 2023 7:46 pm Sort of. 525 bores are mostly small shank, but some makers offer a large shank leadpipe option.

So you can see the source of my confusion, lol.

Just sayin' - it seems that you need to consult with an experienced / professional trombone teacher / coach to straighten out all your confusion / misconceptions.

On what basis would you think a "funnel-shaped" (conical) mouthpiece cup would be an improvement?

You do not live far from some very good trombonists who could help you!

Posaunus wrote: ↑Fri Dec 15, 2023 9:25 pm Just sayin' - it seems that you need to consult with an experienced / professional trombone teacher / coach to straighten out all your confusion / misconceptions.

On what basis would you think a "conical" mouthpiece cup would be an improvement?

You do not live far from some very good trombonists who could help you!

I have taken lessons with some very fine pros on tuba and bass bone, but I am looking for a tenor teacher. My emphasis is Jazz improve. Maybe you can recommend somebody? The conical is just a thought for trying out for myself, no technical reason. I have never tested any Marcinkiewicz, Schilke, Dennis Wicke, or any brands other than Yamaha or Bach mouthpieces in the past and would like to get some direction on what to try.

A Christian Lindberg mouthpiece is pretty funnel shaped, so for a large bore instrument a 5CL or 4CL. They are a bit marmite, either like them or hate them.

StephenK wrote: ↑Sat Dec 16, 2023 6:16 am A Christian Lindberg mouthpiece is pretty funnel shaped, so for a large bore instrument a 5CL or 4CL. They are a bit marmite, either like them or hate them.

Thank you

Is there someplace in SoCal that you can test various mouthpieces before you buy? I just ordered a Denis Wick 5BL to try, but buying and returning or exchanging seems to be problematic at best.