Little secrets that make your playing more musical

[tbdana]

So, what are some secrets, tips, and tricks that anyone can use to make their playing sound better, more musical, and more professional?

I'm not looking for broad generalities like, "practice more." I'm thinking of things we can all employ to sound a little more musical, and that anyone can employ regardless of skill level.

I'll give an example.

One trick really good ballad players use is to play across the natural phrase break without taking a breath. For instance, listen to Dick Nash on "Too Little Time," where he takes a breath before the phrase break and then plays across the break, breathing again in the middle of the next phrase.



Notice how Dick takes a big breath right before the end of the phrase, and just continues to hold that note through the phrase break and into the next phrase (at 00;37-00;47). This works really well because the last note of the phrase and the first note of the next phrase are the same note, but it also works great when the notes change. And boy is it effective!

And you can even do it in other styles, so long as the melody is legato and lyrical. For instance, here I am doing it on a jazz samba.



It is unexpected, it extends the phrase, and sounds masterfully musical. And this is something anyone can do and sound great. And if you can take a really big breath and play a really long phrase it's even better.

What secrets, tips, and tricks can you share that can make our playing sound more musical?

I hope folks will step up and share the things they know. My theory is that the main difference between the way pros play and the way amateurs play has little to do with proficiency and much more to do with little seldom discussed techniques that improve musicality.

Whether it's jazz, classical, zydeco, polkas or whatever, share your tips here please! We all want to learn this stuff.

[Posaunus]

Great examples of musical playing.
I'm not even close to your level of playing, Dana, and much of what you suggest (or do) is beyond my ability.

But one thing that I can do is to imagine singing a melody, rather than just playing it on a trombone.
In fact I often catch myself singing (or whistling) a tune to get myself in the mood before "tromboning" it.

[Nomsis]

On fortepianocrescendos I just start the note, then I take a deep breath and then I crescendo. I have always the most air pushing the crescendo and this gives a nice effect. Of course this works only because there are always enough people barely doing the fortepianocrescendo. Noone ever noticed that I'm doing this, instead I usually get compliments for my fortepianocrescendo.

Note that I'm an amateur playing with other amateurs.

[Mr412]

Great examples of musical playing.
I'm not even close to your level of playing, Dana, and much of what you suggest (or do) is beyond my ability.

But one thing that I can do is to imagine singing a melody, rather than just playing it on a trombone.
In fact I often catch myself singing (or whistling) a tune to get myself in the mood before "tromboning" it.

I think you hit the nail on the head. I believe EVERTHING we play ought to be sung through the horn; warm-ups, scales, apeg's, etc. I can't define musicality, but I know when someone (including myself) is being musical or not and there's a lot of or not going on around us these days. I don't wish to add to it. Lol

[Savio]

So, what are some secrets, tips, and tricks that anyone can use to make their playing sound better, more musical, and more professional?

I'm not looking for broad generalities like, "practice more." I'm thinking of things we can all employ to sound a little more musical, and that anyone can employ regardless of skill level.

I'll give an example.

One trick really good ballad players use is to play across the natural phrase break without taking a breath. For instance, listen to Dick Nash on "Too Little Time," where he takes a breath before the phrase break and then plays across the break, breathing again in the middle of the next phrase.



Notice how Dick takes a big breath right before the end of the phrase, and just continues to hold that note through the phrase break and into the next phrase (at 00;37-00;47). This works really well because the last note of the phrase and the first note of the next phrase are the same note, but it also works great when the notes change. And boy is it effective!

And you can even do it in other styles, so long as the melody is legato and lyrical. For instance, here I am doing it on a jazz samba.



It is unexpected, it extends the phrase, and sounds masterfully musical. And this is something anyone can do and sound great. And if you can take a really big breath and play a really long phrase it's even better.

What secrets, tips, and tricks can you share that can make our playing sound more musical?

I hope folks will step up and share the things they know. My theory is that the main difference between the way pros play and the way amateurs play has little to do with proficiency and much more to do with little seldom discussed techniques that improve musicality.

Whether it's jazz, classical, zydeco, polkas or whatever, share your tips here please! We all want to learn this stuff.

So, what are some secrets, tips, and tricks that anyone can use to make their playing sound better, more musical, and more professional?

I'm not looking for broad generalities like, "practice more." I'm thinking of things we can all employ to sound a little more musical, and that anyone can employ regardless of skill level.

I'll give an example.

One trick really good ballad players use is to play across the natural phrase break without taking a breath. For instance, listen to Dick Nash on "Too Little Time," where he takes a breath before the phrase break and then plays across the break, breathing again in the middle of the next phrase.



Notice how Dick takes a big breath right before the end of the phrase, and just continues to hold that note through the phrase break and into the next phrase (at 00;37-00;47). This works really well because the last note of the phrase and the first note of the next phrase are the same note, but it also works great when the notes change. And boy is it effective!

And you can even do it in other styles, so long as the melody is legato and lyrical. For instance, here I am doing it on a jazz samba.



It is unexpected, it extends the phrase, and sounds masterfully musical. And this is something anyone can do and sound great. And if you can take a really big breath and play a really long phrase it's even better.

What secrets, tips, and tricks can you share that can make our playing sound more musical?

I hope folks will step up and share the things they know. My theory is that the main difference between the way pros play and the way amateurs play has little to do with proficiency and much more to do with little seldom discussed techniques that improve musicality.

Whether it's jazz, classical, zydeco, polkas or whatever, share your tips here please! We all want to learn this stuff.

First of all I love both videos! They are just filled with musicality and good trombone sound in my ears.

I don't think there are any secrets. I believe more in having a strong will to make music with the trombone. That will come from hearing good trombonists make good music. So I listen as many as possible, I also listen to different types of music. I try to be open for everything.

My tips are therefore to listen, go to concerts as much as possible. Nothing can turn you on as much as a live concert.

My boring day and tricks;

Wake up, have a coffee while listening to my trombone ideals. Do some simple flexibility exercises. After that some long notes. See what I can do with the long notes. Approach, dynamic, vibrato/stability. Then have another coffee and listen some more. After that play a melody. Bordogni, pop melody, jazz melody. With a good sound. After that practice things I can't do. For me it's often double and triple tongue. Maybe I'll never get it right, but every day is a new opportunity.

For me its more coffee than results through the years. But the fun is to try every day.

Leif

[LeTromboniste]

Sing. With lyrics. Vocal playing is about consonants and articulations, not long sustained legato lines.

Micromanage your airflow. If you want your playing to be musical, think of your playing as driving a Ferrari on a winding road, not an 18-wheeler on cruise control on the freeway. Shading is one of the most important tools you have at your disposal (and one that very few people actually use) and it requires very fine and subtle control in airflow and air speed, and the ability to make the most sudden and extreme changes.

[elmsandr]

With tone, intensity, and volume changes, every note is going somewhere or coming from somewhere. Decide which and where you want it to be. Write it down. Mark up darned near every note in your music and work it to that notation. Record it and listen to it, if you cannot understand the roadmap that you have made just by listening, you aren’t doing enough.

Cheers,
Andy

[tbdana]

Micromanage your airflow. If you want your playing to be musical, think of your playing as driving a Ferrari on a winding road, not an 18-wheeler on cruise control on the freeway. Shading is one of the most important tools you have at your disposal (and one that very few people actually use) and it requires very fine and subtle control in airflow and air speed, and the ability to make the must sudden and extreme changes.

Yeah, this x 1 million. But that's an awfully broad target. Kind of like saying, "just play well." I'd love to hear your tips for different shading techniques.

[BrassSection]

For me, lots. Starts with choice of trumpet, trombone, euph, or French horn to best match the song.
I will before landing on a Bb for example, start on A, go to C, then come in on the Bb.
Descending chords by guitars, I’ll start same place, but go up to land an octave above.
Skip playing a verse.
When things start to build, hit the note hard and quick, then drop out while others just stay loud. Continue to just hit on the beat.
Echo (usually) bass guitar, or lead and let him echo.
Bounce some varied rhythms back and forth with a good drummer.
Throw a triplet or two in occasionally.
When grandson is on trumpet with me, let him take the lead notes and I’ll harmonize on trumpet, or go to a low brass horn.
When pro trumpet player joins me, on songs that beg for multiple trumpets I’ll play lead trumpet and he adds the embellishments. Otherwise usually my trombone and his trumpet together blending and swapping rests.
Many moons ago had a pro sax player. Easy to mix trumpet or trombone with that, he commented one night “Chicago doesn’t have anything on us!” I wasn’t willing to go that far!
Throw in an ascending/descending run while the band holds last note.
Take euph down into low tuba range on ending notes that are held.
Don’t try to exceed your limitations. I know not to try to hit that super C on my trumpet! I’m a low brass player by birth, trumpet player by necessity.

Relax, be aware of the rest of the band, and have fun.

[LeTromboniste]

With tone, intensity, and volume changes, every note is going somewhere or coming from somewhere. Decide which and where you want it to be.

Yes this! Every note has a role to play. It's not just the long phrase, it's every smaller chunk of phrase, every gesture, and every note within each gesture. Every note has a role within both the gesture and the overall phrase. Even further, different portions of a single note have different roles. The way the note starts, in relation with the previous note. The way the shape of the note relates with its attack, and the context of the gesture. The way the note ends, in relation with what came before, and setting up what's coming after. How all of that goes into creating, supporting or subverting expectations, and generating or changing tension and momentum.

I like to use the analogy of a painter. Every single brush stroke, even if it might be invisible or completely unnoticeable in the final painting, has a role to play in creating the overall effect. Every one of them matters.

[Doug Elliott]

With tone, intensity, and volume changes, every note is going somewhere or coming from somewhere. Decide which and where you want it to be.

Yes this! Every note has a role to play. It's not just the long phrase, it's every smaller chunk of phrase, every gesture, and every note within each gesture. Every note has a role within both the gesture and the overall phrase. Even further, different portions of a single note have different roles. The way the note starts, in relation with the previous note. The way the shape of the note relates with its attack, and the context of the gesture. The way the note ends, in relation with what came before, and setting up what's coming after. How all of that goes into creating, supporting or subverting expectations, and generating or changing tension and momentum.

I like to use the analogy of a painter. Every single brush stroke, even if it might be invisible or completely unnoticeable in the final painting, has a role to play in creating the overall effect. Every one of them matters.

Yes, all of that.
If it's a song, I try to check out the lyrics and make sense out of the melody (and individual note relationships and inflections) to match the lyrics. For that reason I often don't like extending phrases, unless the lyrics warrant it - and they usually don't.
If it doesn't have lyrics, I imagine the melody as if it did have lyrics - make up some words or phrases that fit, or "make it dance." Quite often that means changing the written articulations or phrasing - but I like making better sense of it. Sometimes I think written phrasing is stupidly edited.

[Fidbone]

Listen to Frank Sinatra.

[claf]

I'm far for the quality playing than everyone here, but my personal trick that amazes (almost) everyone I'm playing with is to listen to the music before playing the black and white dots on the sheet music.

Fellow musician: "You play so well, how do you do that?"
Me: "I'm listening a lot to the music before even trying to play it"
Fellow musician (retired and ni kids to take care at home): "I should do that, but I don't have the time"
Me (with a full-time day job and 2 young kids): "Just listen to it in the car"
Fellow musician: "I'd rather listen to the radio"

[Xcomunic8d]

My teacher who studied under Ralph Sauer drilled this over and over. Phrasing.
He expected me to be able to read the music and play what’s on the page.

He ranted about making the horn sing and filling it with air. Playing in columns of air much as described above.
He used the metaphor of painting as you play. Think about shading and nuance.

You guys are so talented on this board. I love your work.
I showed this video to my son and he was like yeah dad that’s what you’re teaching me.

I told him I wish I had been taught this earlier in my trombone days.
Lots of god stuff on this but valuable stuff ends around 5:30. But there are nuggets throughout the whole thing.



I love the style of Ralph Sauer with the the technicality of Joe Alessi.
I wish I played half or even a quarter as well as either of them.

[Wilco]

Great topic! Another one is to vary your articulation, matching it to what you think is needed.

[hyperbolica]

I find something seriously overlooked is balance. In tbone quartet it is assumed that all four voices are essentially equal. They are not. The lead voice needs to be loudest. Lead is not always the highest voice, and it's not always the first part. Then the bass voice, and then the inner voices. So many bad things happen to music when the inner voices are too loud. Sometimes the tune is completely lost or unrecognizable, or it's just unpleasant to listen to.

We have a guy who plays with my quartet who assumes humility is a great trait and it's the same as playing under everyone else. When he gets the lead, you can't hear him. And then we have another guy who just can't play under FF. I try to get people to understand the idea of playing lead by giving everyone the chance to play 1st part and kick off the group for warmups (we usually use 4 part chorales).

I've seen music where the lead voice is highlighted in yellow, which is a great idea. People often ignore actual printed dynamics.

[LeTromboniste]

I find something seriously overlooked is balance. In tbone quartet it is assumed that all four voices are essentially equal. They are not. The lead voice needs to be loudest. Lead is not always the highest voice, and it's not always the first part. Then the bass voice, and then the inner voices. So many bad things happen to music when the inner voices are too loud. Sometimes the tune is completely lost or unrecognizable, or it's just unpleasant to listen to.

We have a guy who plays with my quartet who assumes humility is a great trait and it's the same as playing under everyone else. When he gets the lead, you can't hear him. And then we have another guy who just can't play under FF. I try to get people to understand the idea of playing lead by giving everyone the chance to play 1st part and kick off the group for warmups (we usually use 4 part chorales).

I've seen music where the lead voice is highlighted in yellow, which is a great idea. People often ignore actual printed dynamics.

My experience is that the middle part(s), especially in an orchestral section, have to actually play just a hair louder on average (like, 2-5% louder) than the first, without ever giving the impression that they are louder. And actually alternating between slightly softer, exactly as loud and slightly louder depending on chord voicing. The line between not quite loud enough and too loud is really, really fine. Being a good second is a real art, and the best ones know how to ride that thin line perfectly, and when they actually need to break off of that line and back off.

[tbdana]

I think it depends on context. With Bruckner, the 2nd needs to match the 1st. With Basie, the 2nd should be under the 1st. Etc.

[MolaRam]

Something I was taught and have had success with was that high notes are very easy to play loud and in most cases should be of similar or lower volume as the lower notes in the phrase. If you play the higher notes slightly lower volume they don't stick out.

[BaritoneJack]

With tone, intensity, and volume changes, every note is going somewhere or coming from somewhere. Decide which and where you want it to be. Write it down. Mark up darned near every note in your music and work it to that notation.

Cheers,
Andy

There's a very successful MD I know in England. Under his direction, over the course of not that many years, his band went from 4th Section in band contests to 1st Section - in terms of British brass bands, that's one notch below international status. I heard him talking to his band when they started working on a piece to be played in a contest. As near as I can recall, he said:
"By the time we get to the contest, your score should be covered in pencilled in notes. If it's not, I want to know WHY not."

With best regards,
Jack

[BaritoneJack]

Here's my favourite tip - which I think is a quote from Dizzy Gillespie (please correct me if I'm wrong).
"The silences between the notes are just as important as the notes themselves."

For a classic illustration of the truth of that, remember 'The Dukes of Hazzard'? And that awful air horn which (allegedly) played the opening notes of 'Dixie's Land'?

With best regards,
Jack

[claf]

Here's my favourite tip - which I think is a quote from Dizzy Gillespie (please correct me if I'm wrong).
"The silences between the notes are just as important as the notes themselves."

Miles Davis said: "In music, silence is more important than sound" and "Music is the framework around silence"

[AndrewMeronek]

That great Dick Nash example in the OP reminds me that Tommy Dorsey did the same thing. Also: that little slide scoop to articulate instead of using air or tongue is in Dorsey's style too.

I think that one of the most impactful "little" things is simple ensemble awareness. Think of answering this question: "who is in control of the time?" Find the answer. Hint: it's never the conductor. In some music, that answer will always be the same. But usually, this "who" moves around. Practice finding the "who" as it moves.

[Pezza]

Completely ignore the MD, bass trombone is the most important part!

[GGJazz]

Hi all.

Personally , I think that , in a Jazz music context , an important thing could be how a soloist plays the 8th notes lines that he found on a given melody.
Many times most people play these lines with good jazz feel , but they keep all these 8th notes the same , as when these notes have to be played in Big Band with the whole trbn section .
I guess that one could find a way in which , according to the meaning of the melody tones , some of these 8th notes will be delayed , others anticipated ,etc , so to change that given rhythmic pattern ( as singers do it to follow the lyrics) .

Obviously , I am not talking about the 8th notes lines we find in tunes such as C. Parker' " Donna Lee" , "Confirmation" , etc , rathers about those that are written in Standard Songs as " I had to be You" , "Misty" , ""Autumn in New York" , etc .

Here an example performed by myself , "Serenade in Blue " (on the sheet , on the first , third , and fifth bars of the A sections of this melody , there are eight 8th notes each bar)


Regards
Giancarlo