Quiet playing

[RossM]

How do you all work on playing quietly? I find it very easy to “choke out” when playing quiet technical passages specifically. What do you think about to maintain support/ focus is those situations?

[Doug Elliott]

Work on it separately from "those situations" and then apply it.

[tromboneVan]

Air attacks, starting notes with just the air alone, fading in from nothing to the point at which the note speaks is how I learned and continue to work on the response in that dynamic range. You can practice glissing through the passage at that softer dynamic, making sure that the air is continuous, and then add back in the tongue. The point being not to be dependent on the tongue to start the note, so that you get an accent, but that you start the note with the air vibrating the lips, and then can add back in the tongue for a nice button on the start of the note.

[harrisonreed]

It's all relative. There's quiet playing in a practice room, which can be very difficult. There's quiet playing within an orchestra, which should not be as difficult. They aren't the same thing.

The one thing that I've found that makes dynamic playing easier is a mouthpiece that I made that has a very open throat on top of a relatively tight backbore. This combination somehow seems to act like a turbo-charger for the dynamic range you can get out of the horn. To me, it shifts how much leeway you have at the back of your tongue to control the airflow, and it doesn't "choke" at very low dynamics.

I used to choke on soft playing and I think it's because I was controlling the volume with resistance at my face, instead of the air flow with my tongue.

[RossM]

Thanks for the replies!
What sparked this question was a brass band rehearsal on euphonium yesterday. I honestly expected to not be able to play loud enough for that group, so I was caught off guard by how quiet some sections seemed.

[GabrielRice]

I think it's easy to mistakenly connect soft playing with reducing energy on several fronts, and the common analogy of soft = slow air and loud = fast air is very often counterproductive. On the contrary, soft playing in some ways requires more intensity of the airstream; I often think in terms of spinning the air in a very small, very focused spiral. This visualization does not necessarily apply to all situations, but in any case, I advise avoiding the trap of thinking of soft playing as slow, passive air.

Articulate soft playing also requires more point than articulate loud playing.

[GabrielRice]

One other thought: people often think of soft dynamics as medium dynamics minus something. Soft dynamics are always SOMETHING active and positive.

[tbdana]

I like Gabe's posts.

This is an important thread, I think, and it fits nicely in the earlier thread of mine about playing delicately and with finesse. Playing softly is definitely an "active" endeavor and has its own intensity to it.

As Ralp Sauer observed, "You find out who can really play when the music gets soft."

And as Bill Watrous said in his own unique way, "Any dumb bastard can play loud. You have to be a player to play soft."

* * * * *

One thing I do is I'll pick one or two days per week to practice everything in my practice day as softly as I possibly can, from the first warmup note to the last note of the day. High notes, low notes, intervals, flexibility exercises, scales, excerpts and etudes all get played with the absolute softest sound I can make and still get a note out of the horn. "How softly can I play this and still get a sound? Now that I've found that place, can I make the tone sound good at that volume, without getting louder?" And do that all day long, and do it repeatedly over time. And boy, does doing that help focus-in the chops and helps me play better overall.

The "choking" comment confuses me, though. I'm not sure what that's about. Does that mean that you try to reduce the volume by closing down your throat? If so, definitely don't do that. Indeed, I find that playing really soft requires me to relax and open my throat as much as possible.

[mbarbier]

+10,000 to all of Gabe's posts.


An excerise i got taught by Mike Svoboda that's really helped me is to attack a comfortable note at a F/MF volume then decres. to the softest you can play focusing on just comfortably letting the center get smaller (as in the physical center of your embouchure). Release then simply re attack the same point several times, so essentially repeating the physical sensation of a soft note. Then, once it feels comfortable, sustain one and crescendo back to a louder volume. It's always felt to me like playing the pitch you're about to play on a piano before playing it- just reminding yourself where the soft can be then repeating the sensation to learn to play softly in a physically relaxed way.

Also Charlier Vernon's Signing Approach has some really really helpful concepts on soft playing and eay connection.

I've always heard it attributed to Alessia but don't know if it's actually his- "you don't get fire for playing too loud, you get fired for not playing soft enough."

always like that one.

[boneAngo]

it's like a big sphere (loud) and a small one (soft) but the materials, density inside are all the same. if u know what's similar figures (maths) then the sound or the things u r gonna do is to decrease the things in ratio (some parts size, some parts intensity). Just don't forget the air speed is independent of the sound intensity but dependent of the pitch.
If you ask me how am I gonna achieve this or practice this I can tell you: Long tones with tuner and metronome. (they are for you to gain control of your instrument). Nevertheless, practice everything slow, 2 times or even 4 times slower than the original speed, with the breathing positions unchanged. (they are for you to practice air control). Last but not least, I find practicing loud passages useful for your quiet playing in some way (just like I find practicing lower register helps my upper register a lot). Anyway, just stay positive and ongoing on your practice routine and gain more control on your horn and you will be fine.

[RossM]

I like Gabe's posts.

This is an important thread, I think, and it fits nicely in the earlier thread of mine about playing delicately and with finesse. Playing softly is definitely an "active" endeavor and has its own intensity to it.

As Ralp Sauer observed, "You find out who can really play when the music gets soft."

And as Bill Watrous said in his own unique way, "Any dumb bastard can play loud. You have to be a player to play soft."

* * * * *

One thing I do is I'll pick one or two days per week to practice everything in my practice day as softly as I possibly can, from the first warmup note to the last note of the day. High notes, low notes, intervals, flexibility exercises, scales, excerpts and etudes all get played with the absolute softest sound I can make and still get a note out of the horn. "How softly can I play this and still get a sound? Now that I've found that place, can I make the tone sound good at that volume, without getting louder?" And do that all day long, and do it repeatedly over time. And boy, does doing that help focus-in the chops and helps me play better overall.

The "choking" comment confuses me, though. I'm not sure what that's about. Does that mean that you try to reduce the volume by closing down your throat? If so, definitely don't do that. Indeed, I find that playing really soft requires me to relax and open my throat as much as possible.

Thanks Dana, that sounds like a solid practice plan, I’ll try it out!

By choking I basically just mean losing the sound, whether from lack of support or closing down the aperture too much, not necessarily closing the throat.

[RossM]

I think it's easy to mistakenly connect soft playing with reducing energy on several fronts, and the common analogy of soft = slow air and loud = fast air is very often counterproductive. On the contrary, soft playing in some ways requires more intensity of the airstream; I often think in terms of spinning the air in a very small, very focused spiral. This visualization does not necessarily apply to all situations, but in any case, I advise avoiding the trap of thinking of soft playing as slow, passive air.

Articulate soft playing also requires more point than articulate loud playing.

Thanks Gabe, I’ve definitely been missing some intensity when trying to play softly. I like that visualization!

[RossM]

+10,000 to all of Gabe's posts.


An excerise i got taught by Mike Svoboda that's really helped me is to attack a comfortable note at a F/MF volume then decres. to the softest you can play focusing on just comfortably letting the center get smaller (as in the physical center of your embouchure). Release then simply re attack the same point several times, so essentially repeating the physical sensation of a soft note. Then, once it feels comfortable, sustain one and crescendo back to a louder volume. It's always felt to me like playing the pitch you're about to play on a piano before playing it- just reminding yourself where the soft can be then repeating the sensation to learn to play softly in a physically relaxed way.

Also Charlier Vernon's Signing Approach has some really really helpful concepts on soft playing and eay connection.

I've always heard it attributed to Alessia but don't know if it's actually his- "you don't get fire for playing too loud, you get fired for not playing soft enough."

always like that one.

That feels like a great exercise, thanks!

[LeTromboniste]

Gabe is spot on! Softer takes more focus, more support, not less. Obviously it uses less air, but the air needs to be extra active.

One thing that I believe has helped me is playing with a very resistant homemade practice mute (one where I basically can't play music on it) and constantly try to play softer than I could before. I think it has helped my embouchure get used to being able to vibrate with the tiniest amount of air, my tongue figure out the softest articulation I can get, how it needs to get out of the way differently than when playing loud in order for the buzz not to stop, and to familiarize myself with the physical sensations of playing that soft.

I agree that articulate soft typically needs more pointed articulations, but to me that's with a lighter, very fast tongue. A common impediment to playing really soft is the tongue being too heavy and getting in the way of the air. People get away with that when playing loud because there's so much air behind it, but when the amount is below a certain threshold, a heavy tongue will often make the buzz stop.

In any case, playing super soft in a totally controlled way is something you need to constantly cultivate. Not just on its own as an exercise, or for playing entire soft passages, but all the time. When you're playing a phrase mf or mp, explore with still having some notes that are p or pp or ppp.

As Ralp Sauer observed, "You find out who can really play when the music gets soft."

And as Bill Watrous said in his own unique way, "Any dumb bastard can play loud. You have to be a player to play soft."

I'll add this very similar quote from Luigi Zenobi (a virtuoso cornett player of the 16th century) about the difference between good and bad wind players:

"It is true that more is required of players of wind instruments, for they must know all the quality, quantity and variety of tonguings, the intonation of the instrument, and the forte and piano, when they are called for. But they must cultivate the piano more than the forte, for the first serves in princely chambers and places of respect, and it is the main way the faults or the excellence of the player are disclosed, which does not occur in bandstands and chapels and wherever one plays as loud as one can, because people there have little understanding or experience of anything."

[GGJazz]

Hi Folks.

In my opinion , if we talk about playing soft or loud both in a incorrect way , for sure playing loud will result easier.
But if one is playing the right way , as in a good professional Symphony Orchestra , Jazz Big Band , etc , playing very loud , with good clear tone , intonation , etc , will be equally challenging as playing soft .

Just listen to excerpts as Wagner' "Die Walkure" , or "Tannhauser" : I guess that is not true at all that any "dumd bastard" can play it ...!

CSO low brass : "Die Walkure " 0.00 ; "Tannhauser" 23:09


Also playing in Big Band with loud dynamics could be not so easy : check Count Basie' "The kid from Red Bank"


Of course , playig soft , controlled , and clear , is a challenging aspect of brass' playing , and I love this way in my playing .
Anyway , I think that every extreme dynamics are very difficult to express at their best .

Regards
Giancarlo

[mbarbier]

That feels like a great exercise, thanks!

You're welcome!

[JTeagarden]

I think of soft much in the same way as playing "background" voices: not being the loudest or the main line is not a reason to play less beautifully or intensely.

Ever notice how the great players also sound great in a supporting role? They never phone it in, that's how I think of playing softly: you should sound far away, not disinterested.